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This is more than just a fake resume. He claimed to be an engineer, which is a profession with real formal qualifications, because there are real consequences

This is more than just a fake resume. He claimed to be an engineer, which is a profession with real formal qualifications, because there are real consequences (e.g. buildings falling down, bridges collapsing, people dying.)

alephnerd 2y ago
He also forged qualifications and references. The case is also linked to the larger system of patronage and state capture that existed under Zuma, where if you paid the right people who back then were in the ANC, plenty of doors would open up. Cyril Ramaphosa began a cleanup of the ANC, but it's still a work in progress AND Zuma and his patronage network have created their own party that is undercutting the ANC's vote share (at least the private sector forced the ANC-DA-IFP coalition). It's a stunning reversal for a country that 15 years ago was on track to become a developed country. South Africa in the late 2000s to 2011 was at the same distance from becoming a World Bank High Income country that Serbia and China are at today in the late 2010s and early 2020s, and South African companies like Naspers (Reddit, Tencent, VK, StackOverflow, Udemy, OLX), MTN Group (major telco player in MENA), ShopRite (major retailer across Africa which is basically a Walmart or Lidl-lite), and Vodacom (major telco and formerly satellite player in MENA and Asia) were on track to becoming major players globally.
- inglor_cz 2y ago
  "Zuma and his patronage network have created their own party that is undercutting the ANC's vote share." At least they are in the opposition now and not in government. If they stayed within ANC, they would have much more influence.
  - Der_Einzige 2y ago
    And don’t forget that there’s always the threat of the EFF Nazbols and their red shirts…
loceng 2y ago
What if he outsourced his work to actual engineers?..
- alephnerd 2y ago
  It was a patronage role (think like the no work jobs in The Sopranos). A portion of his salary most likely ended up in the party fund.
- petre 2y ago
  Outsource what, influence peddling? Good riddance.
- marcel_hecko 2y ago
  In that case he is not acting as a chief engineer,rather as a procurement or purchaser. Chief engineer is not a role where you can simply pass on engineering responsibility to third party.
  - jasomill 2y ago
    In contexts where "engineer" is a licensed title like "doctor of medicine" and "attorney at law", sure. But the point of credentials like these is not only that they're shorthand for a range of requirements (degree granted by appropriately accredited institution, passed licensing exam, insured, practice complies with relevant professional standards, etc.), but also that they're issued by organizations that have mechanisms in place to verify that a particular applicant actually possesses the credential in question, e.g., https://www.iardc.org/Lawyer/PrintableDetails/0ae1f2b7-a864-eb11-b810-000d3a9f4eeb?includeFormerNames=False https://www.iardc.org/Lawyer/PrintableDetails/0ae1f2b7-a864-...
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
gerdesj 2y ago
"He claimed to be an engineer" There are many here that do the same: Many IT jobs have titles with engineer (and architect, int al) in them. Those "engineers" are not chartered in the formal sense. The term engineer is somewhat watered down these days, in a formal sense - it has become commonplace. I studied as far as what can be described as a civil engineering technician. Not an engineer. I own an IT company with 30+ years time served at the ... keyboard and rack and rails. I've frozen my nuts off in ill advisedly cold computer rooms to rescue improbably important systems and so on. Anyway, I allow some of my staff to call themselves technicians or techies, never engineers. I encourage the term "consultant" for time served staff.
- miki123211 2y ago
  > The term engineer is somewhat watered down these days That's a US thing, there are countries (notably Canada) where advertising yourself as an engineer without actually earning the title is illegal.
  - digitalPhonix 2y ago
    Not true - professional engineering bodies in Canada are full of themselves and like to claim that though. Professional Engineers Ontario for example claims here that: > The term Engineer/Professional Engineer/P.Eng. can only be used by those that have been granted a licence by PEO, under the authority of the Professional Engineers Act. The title “Engineer” is restricted to Ontario licence holders under s. 40(2)(a.1) of the Act. Which is a very disingenuous interpretation of that clause: > (a.1) uses the title “engineer” or an abbreviation of that title in a manner that will lead to the belief that the person may engage in the practice of professional engineering; And conveniently ignores the context of the previous clause to distinguish “engineer” and “professional engineer” > (a) uses the title “professional engineer” or “ingénieur” or an abbreviation or variation thereof as an occupational or business designation;
    - jpambrun 2y ago
      I feel those two quotes are pretty aligned? What is the issue?

alephnerd 2y ago

He also forged qualifications and references. The case is also linked to the larger system of patronage and state capture that existed under Zuma, where if you paid the right people who back then were in the ANC, plenty of doors would open up. Cyril Ramaphosa began a cleanup of the ANC, but it's still a work in progress AND Zuma and his patronage network have created their own party that is undercutting the ANC's vote share (at least the private sector forced the ANC-DA-IFP coalition). It's a stunning reversal for a country that 15 years ago was on track to become a developed country. South Africa in the late 2000s to 2011 was at the same distance from becoming a World Bank High Income country that Serbia and China are at today in the late 2010s and early 2020s, and South African companies like Naspers (Reddit, Tencent, VK, StackOverflow, Udemy, OLX), MTN Group (major telco player in MENA), ShopRite (major retailer across Africa which is basically a Walmart or Lidl-lite), and Vodacom (major telco and formerly satellite player in MENA and Asia) were on track to becoming major players globally.

inglor_cz 2y ago
"Zuma and his patronage network have created their own party that is undercutting the ANC's vote share." At least they are in the opposition now and not in government. If they stayed within ANC, they would have much more influence.
- Der_Einzige 2y ago
  And don’t forget that there’s always the threat of the EFF Nazbols and their red shirts…

loceng 2y ago

What if he outsourced his work to actual engineers?..

alephnerd 2y ago
It was a patronage role (think like the no work jobs in The Sopranos). A portion of his salary most likely ended up in the party fund.
petre 2y ago
Outsource what, influence peddling? Good riddance.
marcel_hecko 2y ago
In that case he is not acting as a chief engineer,rather as a procurement or purchaser. Chief engineer is not a role where you can simply pass on engineering responsibility to third party.
- jasomill 2y ago
  In contexts where "engineer" is a licensed title like "doctor of medicine" and "attorney at law", sure. But the point of credentials like these is not only that they're shorthand for a range of requirements (degree granted by appropriately accredited institution, passed licensing exam, insured, practice complies with relevant professional standards, etc.), but also that they're issued by organizations that have mechanisms in place to verify that a particular applicant actually possesses the credential in question, e.g., https://www.iardc.org/Lawyer/PrintableDetails/0ae1f2b7-a864-eb11-b810-000d3a9f4eeb?includeFormerNames=False https://www.iardc.org/Lawyer/PrintableDetails/0ae1f2b7-a864-...

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

gerdesj 2y ago

"He claimed to be an engineer" There are many here that do the same: Many IT jobs have titles with engineer (and architect, int al) in them. Those "engineers" are not chartered in the formal sense. The term engineer is somewhat watered down these days, in a formal sense - it has become commonplace. I studied as far as what can be described as a civil engineering technician. Not an engineer. I own an IT company with 30+ years time served at the ... keyboard and rack and rails. I've frozen my nuts off in ill advisedly cold computer rooms to rescue improbably important systems and so on. Anyway, I allow some of my staff to call themselves technicians or techies, never engineers. I encourage the term "consultant" for time served staff.

miki123211 2y ago
> The term engineer is somewhat watered down these days That's a US thing, there are countries (notably Canada) where advertising yourself as an engineer without actually earning the title is illegal.
- digitalPhonix 2y ago
  Not true - professional engineering bodies in Canada are full of themselves and like to claim that though. Professional Engineers Ontario for example claims here that: > The term Engineer/Professional Engineer/P.Eng. can only be used by those that have been granted a licence by PEO, under the authority of the Professional Engineers Act. The title “Engineer” is restricted to Ontario licence holders under s. 40(2)(a.1) of the Act. Which is a very disingenuous interpretation of that clause: > (a.1) uses the title “engineer” or an abbreviation of that title in a manner that will lead to the belief that the person may engage in the practice of professional engineering; And conveniently ignores the context of the previous clause to distinguish “engineer” and “professional engineer” > (a) uses the title “professional engineer” or “ingénieur” or an abbreviation or variation thereof as an occupational or business designation;
  - jpambrun 2y ago
    I feel those two quotes are pretty aligned? What is the issue?