4 ms·

Not being familiar with this guy's work, what's so honest about getting in bed with credit card companies and feeding them more signups? Selling lead generation

Not being familiar with this guy's work, what's so honest about getting in bed with credit card companies and feeding them more signups? Selling lead generation for credit cards seems a little dishonest to begin with.

olliesaunders 14y ago
I want to agree with you. Could you be specific about what exactly is dishonest here and why?
- _delirium 14y ago
  I don't think it's inherently dishonest, but I do think that you have to have enough self-restraint to avoid pushing things that are questionable, but give good lead-gen kickbacks. It's not 100% obvious where that line lies, admittedly. I run a small side-project site (started as just something for friends/family) that lists checking and savings accounts that are free of "gotchas": free checking w/ no minimum balances, online savings accounts without weird caveats, etc. (http://www.pfstuff.com/checking/ http://www.pfstuff.com/checking/ and http://www.pfstuff.com/savings/ http://www.pfstuff.com/savings/, fwiw). But, I also show some AdSense ads alongside some of the pages... which have the bad habit of advertising precisely the accounts that don't fit my criteria, and which I'm trying to steer people away from. Not always, but Google's algorithms rotate in such "bad choice" accounts more often than I'd like. I can ban some of the more egregious "10% guaranteed interest!" type stuff via AdSense's settings, but not everything. Perhaps I should just pull the ads entirely? That'd be the idealist thing to do, but of course would remove the (modest) monetization potential.
- metronegative 14y ago
  I am having trouble phrasing it but.... a long time ago I had the opportunity to make lots of money through a popular Facebook game I created. OfferPal was interested in having me sell credit card leads. I didn't like the idea of irresponsible younger people signing up for credit cards and giving their personal information out and accumulating debt just to get more XP in my game so.... I declined. This guy did that but then took the high ground and reversed. Not because he didn't like selling leads but because he valued his freedom of expression more.
  - SeanOC 14y ago
    I think the key difference here is the audience. Offering credit cards to college kids is very different than offering cards to a more mature audience. Especially when you've been teaching that audience how to use credit cards as what they are, tools. There's also a significant difference here in that in your situation, you would have been providing the rewards and you would have had power to artificially manipulate the value of those rewards (make it harder to win your game without reward points. Here, the author doesn't provide the rewards he is simply stating what offers the credit card companies themselves are making. At the end of the day, there is certainly still a moral hazard here but it is also a very different situation than the one you described.
speg 14y ago
Presumably his readers are smart enough to get a deal. He mentions using Google Calander to cancel cards before fees kick in. So I assume he's not selling his readers down the river, but helping them 'hack' the system.
- mibbitier 14y ago
  Yeah I would advise against that. Last time I checked, your credit score will plumet if you do that sort of thing. If you pay off your debts without paying any interest all the time, you're pretty much a terrible person to lend money to. The credit card companies also rely on the fact that however organised people thing they are going to be, a good amount of them slip up. Once they have credit, maybe they dip into it, then can't repay it all, or they miss the interest free deadline etc. Please stay away from credit cards everyone :)
  - redslazer 14y ago
    Im not american so bare with me on this question. So my credit score is based not on my repayment history or my financial stability but the potential profit of making a loan/credit to me? So if im cancelling credit cards before the interest free period is up this reflects badly on me? Why?
    - mchanson 14y ago
      Nope. Credit score is about the ability to repay in the US. Parent doesn't know what he is talking about. However credit cart companies do like you better if you are the type to 'slip up', mortgage lenders not so much.
      - mibbitier 14y ago
        > Nope. Credit score is about the ability to repay in the US. Parent doesn't know what he is talking about. OR I'm not in the US. Other countries exist. I'd be surprised if credit companies even in the US don't share the information on "low or no profit users" - ones who religiously pay off loans without paying any interest.
PythonDeveloper 14y ago
No more or less honest than running TV commercials to get you to buy products during a television show. I presume you have some sort of logarithmic honesty scale by which one can measure their dastardliness? If so, please share.
kprobst 14y ago
Without intending to pass judgement on the author of the article, the word you're looking for here is 'sleazy'.
ImprovedSilence 14y ago
It's a blog about how to make (and save) money. I think he was picking out cards that offered $100 to sign up, and were free for the first year kinda thing. With the expectation that the type of people that read his blog would game that to their advantage. Perfectly honest in my view.

olliesaunders 14y ago

I want to agree with you. Could you be specific about what exactly is dishonest here and why?

_delirium 14y ago
I don't think it's inherently dishonest, but I do think that you have to have enough self-restraint to avoid pushing things that are questionable, but give good lead-gen kickbacks. It's not 100% obvious where that line lies, admittedly. I run a small side-project site (started as just something for friends/family) that lists checking and savings accounts that are free of "gotchas": free checking w/ no minimum balances, online savings accounts without weird caveats, etc. (http://www.pfstuff.com/checking/ http://www.pfstuff.com/checking/ and http://www.pfstuff.com/savings/ http://www.pfstuff.com/savings/, fwiw). But, I also show some AdSense ads alongside some of the pages... which have the bad habit of advertising precisely the accounts that don't fit my criteria, and which I'm trying to steer people away from. Not always, but Google's algorithms rotate in such "bad choice" accounts more often than I'd like. I can ban some of the more egregious "10% guaranteed interest!" type stuff via AdSense's settings, but not everything. Perhaps I should just pull the ads entirely? That'd be the idealist thing to do, but of course would remove the (modest) monetization potential.
metronegative 14y ago
I am having trouble phrasing it but.... a long time ago I had the opportunity to make lots of money through a popular Facebook game I created. OfferPal was interested in having me sell credit card leads. I didn't like the idea of irresponsible younger people signing up for credit cards and giving their personal information out and accumulating debt just to get more XP in my game so.... I declined. This guy did that but then took the high ground and reversed. Not because he didn't like selling leads but because he valued his freedom of expression more.
- SeanOC 14y ago
  I think the key difference here is the audience. Offering credit cards to college kids is very different than offering cards to a more mature audience. Especially when you've been teaching that audience how to use credit cards as what they are, tools. There's also a significant difference here in that in your situation, you would have been providing the rewards and you would have had power to artificially manipulate the value of those rewards (make it harder to win your game without reward points. Here, the author doesn't provide the rewards he is simply stating what offers the credit card companies themselves are making. At the end of the day, there is certainly still a moral hazard here but it is also a very different situation than the one you described.

speg 14y ago

Presumably his readers are smart enough to get a deal. He mentions using Google Calander to cancel cards before fees kick in. So I assume he's not selling his readers down the river, but helping them 'hack' the system.

mibbitier 14y ago
Yeah I would advise against that. Last time I checked, your credit score will plumet if you do that sort of thing. If you pay off your debts without paying any interest all the time, you're pretty much a terrible person to lend money to. The credit card companies also rely on the fact that however organised people thing they are going to be, a good amount of them slip up. Once they have credit, maybe they dip into it, then can't repay it all, or they miss the interest free deadline etc. Please stay away from credit cards everyone :)
- redslazer 14y ago
  Im not american so bare with me on this question. So my credit score is based not on my repayment history or my financial stability but the potential profit of making a loan/credit to me? So if im cancelling credit cards before the interest free period is up this reflects badly on me? Why?
  - mchanson 14y ago
    Nope. Credit score is about the ability to repay in the US. Parent doesn't know what he is talking about. However credit cart companies do like you better if you are the type to 'slip up', mortgage lenders not so much.
    - mibbitier 14y ago
      > Nope. Credit score is about the ability to repay in the US. Parent doesn't know what he is talking about. OR I'm not in the US. Other countries exist. I'd be surprised if credit companies even in the US don't share the information on "low or no profit users" - ones who religiously pay off loans without paying any interest.

PythonDeveloper 14y ago

No more or less honest than running TV commercials to get you to buy products during a television show. I presume you have some sort of logarithmic honesty scale by which one can measure their dastardliness? If so, please share.

kprobst 14y ago

Without intending to pass judgement on the author of the article, the word you're looking for here is 'sleazy'.

ImprovedSilence 14y ago

It's a blog about how to make (and save) money. I think he was picking out cards that offered $100 to sign up, and were free for the first year kinda thing. With the expectation that the type of people that read his blog would game that to their advantage. Perfectly honest in my view.