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>The point is that there should be no wifi at all during these deployments You seriously expect a bunch of ~20-year-old people to go without internet access fo

>The point is that there should be no wifi at all during these deployments You seriously expect a bunch of ~20-year-old people to go without internet access for 6-9 months at a time? Good luck with recruiting.

pests 2y ago
Yes? These people are supposed to go fight wars for us and defend our freedom... I would expect them to be making a lot of sacrifices, the lack of Internet being a relatively minor one.
- killjoywashere 2y ago
  How many sacrifices would you make for $30,000 a year?
  - SV_BubbleTime 2y ago
    The current bonus for Air GUARD is $50k. Your 30k is way off not to mention GI Bill and VA coverage for life. And yes, I expect “oh gosh we might not have internet” to be something the military can handle.
    - pseudo0 2y ago
      $50k on a four year contract. That extra $12.5k helps, but the total comp is still way below a civilian job that typically has better work life balance and better working conditions.
      - deleted 2y ago
        [deleted]
    - purpleidea 2y ago
      > GI Bill and VA coverage for life Yeah, sounds good until you see in practice how so many veterans are forgotten, let alone the millions without any healthcare at all. Healthcare should be a human right for everyone.
      - SV_BubbleTime 2y ago
        What years did you serve?
        stonogo 2y ago
        I served from 1998 to 2005. You only get "VA for life" if you incur a permanent service-connected disability. Everyone else who uses VA pays for it and are prioritized lower than disabled veterans. Retirees do not have access to VA care unless they too have a disability.
    - NavinF 2y ago
      > VA coverage for life How much is this actually worth? If you have a full time job, you'll get insurance through the job. If not, you'll likely qualify for Medicaid. Here in California half the residents get free health insurance via Medicaid
  - dghlsakjg 2y ago
    You think people enlist for the money? You are also overestimating the salary of a fresh enlistee. Everyone below E-3 makes less than 30k
    - toomuchtodo 2y ago
      Hence the inability to source recruits. Easier to work at Home Depot or Target. ($30k/year is ~$15-16/hr) https://www.defense.gov/News/News-Stories/Article/article/3616786/dod-addresses-recruiting-shortfall-challenges/ https://www.defense.gov/News/News-Stories/Article/article/36...
      - dghlsakjg 2y ago
        The article you linked cites competitive pay as reason to join… It cites a variety of reasons why they are having issues, but pay isn’t one of them.
        toomuchtodo 2y ago
        > The causes of the recruiting challenges "are complex and multifaceted," Vazirani said. They include: > A strong economy, which has resulted in many more options for young people. Additional citation: https://www.aei.org/research-products/report/mcdonalds-or-the-army-a-california-case-study/ https://www.aei.org/research-products/report/mcdonalds-or-th... > McDonald’s or the Army? A California Case Study > On measures that often matter most to military recruits, such as cash compensation, the military is falling behind civilian wages. > The need for a large increase in junior enlisted wages becomes apparent when one considers two issues: the looming demographic cliff for America’s youth and competition from the labor market. According to the College and University Professional Association for Human Resources, it is projected that between 2025 and 2029, the US will see its population of 18-year-olds drop from 9.4 million to roughly 8 million, a 15 percent decrease.
      - m463 2y ago
        and home depot stock has been going up steadily
- shiroiushi 2y ago
  Another poster posted this link, but I'll post it again: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39169676 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39169676 If you think it's so important, why aren't you making this sacrifice? The Navy already can't meet its recruitment goals. Where exactly do you think all these selfless, freedom-defending 18-year-olds willing to go without internet are going to come from?
  - pests 2y ago
    I would if I could but time, age, and circumstances prevented it. I just think "not having internet" is very low on the list of concerns, and if it isn't, maybe those people need to re-evaluate their situation and priorities. You are on a ship, where you can't visit friends or family and loved ones, where you have given up your rights and freedom, your choice about anything you consume or do, and you might literally not make it back home. I think the recruitment goals are caused by other things.
  - hollerith 2y ago
    If you think constant recreational internet access is necessary to live a worthwhile and tolerable life, you would probably benefit from a pause in recreational internet use.
- maxglute 2y ago
  There's surveys people would rather give up food, alcohol, socialization, sex, basic hygiene etc than internet. It's crazy but it's increasingly not a small sacrifice if navy wants billets filled by newer gens.
josh_carterPDX 2y ago
I joined the Navy in 94 (got out in 98). Reading these comments is giving me PTSD. I still had to mail letters and remember my calling card number to make calls when I got into port. That was the only way I could stay connected with home. The fact that people serving in the military get ANY connection is blowing my mind right now. Especially given the operational tempo I am assuming they have to deal with day in and day out. I know for me every other day was a 21-hour day. Thinking about having internet while forward deployed just sounds exhausting.
JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> seriously expect a bunch of ~20-year-old people to go without internet access for 6-9 months at a time? Yes, we generally want mental stability in the people manning our war machines. (Also discipline.)
- redserk 2y ago
  Are you seriously willing to volunteer, or is this expecting that others step up where you’d fail? It’s awfully easy to demand expectations from others behind the safety and comfort of a desk.
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    > is this expecting that others step up where you’d fail? This is a nonsense argument. I’m not willing to go med school, that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t require it for doctors. A fighting force addicted to their phones is vulnerable. You can’t have the first time your Navy goes cold turkey on a psychological dependence be during combat.
    - shiroiushi 2y ago
      Fine, if you want to prevent sailors from having modern internet access, then you just need to accept you're going to have a very small Navy and plan accordingly, because very few young people are going to want to join. You can't force people to agree with your opinion. Perhaps you could convince the Navy to open their recruitment to the 55+ age segment.
      - dazilcher 2y ago
        That's quite the hyperbole - I'm pretty sure internet access is a secondary concern at best, when deciding to join the Navy. Sailors are giving up a lot more in terms of personal life, fixating on internet access as a dealbreaker is such an odd take.
ToDougie 2y ago
Recruitment is down because one key demographic is no longer signing up. WiFi speeds are the least of that demographic's concerns.

pests 2y ago

Yes? These people are supposed to go fight wars for us and defend our freedom... I would expect them to be making a lot of sacrifices, the lack of Internet being a relatively minor one.

killjoywashere 2y ago
How many sacrifices would you make for $30,000 a year?
- SV_BubbleTime 2y ago
  The current bonus for Air GUARD is $50k. Your 30k is way off not to mention GI Bill and VA coverage for life. And yes, I expect “oh gosh we might not have internet” to be something the military can handle.
  - pseudo0 2y ago
    $50k on a four year contract. That extra $12.5k helps, but the total comp is still way below a civilian job that typically has better work life balance and better working conditions.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
  - purpleidea 2y ago
    > GI Bill and VA coverage for life Yeah, sounds good until you see in practice how so many veterans are forgotten, let alone the millions without any healthcare at all. Healthcare should be a human right for everyone.
    - SV_BubbleTime 2y ago
      What years did you serve?
      - stonogo 2y ago
        I served from 1998 to 2005. You only get "VA for life" if you incur a permanent service-connected disability. Everyone else who uses VA pays for it and are prioritized lower than disabled veterans. Retirees do not have access to VA care unless they too have a disability.
  - NavinF 2y ago
    > VA coverage for life How much is this actually worth? If you have a full time job, you'll get insurance through the job. If not, you'll likely qualify for Medicaid. Here in California half the residents get free health insurance via Medicaid
- dghlsakjg 2y ago
  You think people enlist for the money? You are also overestimating the salary of a fresh enlistee. Everyone below E-3 makes less than 30k
  - toomuchtodo 2y ago
    Hence the inability to source recruits. Easier to work at Home Depot or Target. ($30k/year is ~$15-16/hr) https://www.defense.gov/News/News-Stories/Article/article/3616786/dod-addresses-recruiting-shortfall-challenges/ https://www.defense.gov/News/News-Stories/Article/article/36...
    - dghlsakjg 2y ago
      The article you linked cites competitive pay as reason to join… It cites a variety of reasons why they are having issues, but pay isn’t one of them.
      - toomuchtodo 2y ago
        > The causes of the recruiting challenges "are complex and multifaceted," Vazirani said. They include: > A strong economy, which has resulted in many more options for young people. Additional citation: https://www.aei.org/research-products/report/mcdonalds-or-the-army-a-california-case-study/ https://www.aei.org/research-products/report/mcdonalds-or-th... > McDonald’s or the Army? A California Case Study > On measures that often matter most to military recruits, such as cash compensation, the military is falling behind civilian wages. > The need for a large increase in junior enlisted wages becomes apparent when one considers two issues: the looming demographic cliff for America’s youth and competition from the labor market. According to the College and University Professional Association for Human Resources, it is projected that between 2025 and 2029, the US will see its population of 18-year-olds drop from 9.4 million to roughly 8 million, a 15 percent decrease.
    - m463 2y ago
      and home depot stock has been going up steadily
shiroiushi 2y ago
Another poster posted this link, but I'll post it again: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39169676 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39169676 If you think it's so important, why aren't you making this sacrifice? The Navy already can't meet its recruitment goals. Where exactly do you think all these selfless, freedom-defending 18-year-olds willing to go without internet are going to come from?
- pests 2y ago
  I would if I could but time, age, and circumstances prevented it. I just think "not having internet" is very low on the list of concerns, and if it isn't, maybe those people need to re-evaluate their situation and priorities. You are on a ship, where you can't visit friends or family and loved ones, where you have given up your rights and freedom, your choice about anything you consume or do, and you might literally not make it back home. I think the recruitment goals are caused by other things.
- hollerith 2y ago
  If you think constant recreational internet access is necessary to live a worthwhile and tolerable life, you would probably benefit from a pause in recreational internet use.
maxglute 2y ago
There's surveys people would rather give up food, alcohol, socialization, sex, basic hygiene etc than internet. It's crazy but it's increasingly not a small sacrifice if navy wants billets filled by newer gens.

josh_carterPDX 2y ago

I joined the Navy in 94 (got out in 98). Reading these comments is giving me PTSD. I still had to mail letters and remember my calling card number to make calls when I got into port. That was the only way I could stay connected with home. The fact that people serving in the military get ANY connection is blowing my mind right now. Especially given the operational tempo I am assuming they have to deal with day in and day out. I know for me every other day was a 21-hour day. Thinking about having internet while forward deployed just sounds exhausting.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago

> seriously expect a bunch of ~20-year-old people to go without internet access for 6-9 months at a time? Yes, we generally want mental stability in the people manning our war machines. (Also discipline.)

redserk 2y ago
Are you seriously willing to volunteer, or is this expecting that others step up where you’d fail? It’s awfully easy to demand expectations from others behind the safety and comfort of a desk.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > is this expecting that others step up where you’d fail? This is a nonsense argument. I’m not willing to go med school, that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t require it for doctors. A fighting force addicted to their phones is vulnerable. You can’t have the first time your Navy goes cold turkey on a psychological dependence be during combat.
  - shiroiushi 2y ago
    Fine, if you want to prevent sailors from having modern internet access, then you just need to accept you're going to have a very small Navy and plan accordingly, because very few young people are going to want to join. You can't force people to agree with your opinion. Perhaps you could convince the Navy to open their recruitment to the 55+ age segment.
    - dazilcher 2y ago
      That's quite the hyperbole - I'm pretty sure internet access is a secondary concern at best, when deciding to join the Navy. Sailors are giving up a lot more in terms of personal life, fixating on internet access as a dealbreaker is such an odd take.

ToDougie 2y ago

Recruitment is down because one key demographic is no longer signing up. WiFi speeds are the least of that demographic's concerns.