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That is flatly false. Worker cooperatives are every bit as innovative as any other form of private corporation. These are owned by workers not a centralized go
by dbingham 2y ago
That is flatly false. Worker cooperatives are every bit as innovative as any other form of private corporation. These are owned by workers not a centralized government. There are quite a few of them and you may well have purchased their products with it even realizing it. Two additional examples you may have encountered are Equal Exchange and King Arthur Flour.
There aren't more of them because they have a hell of a time securing financing when most businesses are financed through equity sales which they can't do.
- trhway 2y agoExample of innovation please. I’ve seen first hand that no collective farm is able to produce nor SpaceX nor even EV nor even plant in time and harvest in time.
- __MatrixMan__ 2y agoI'm not close enough to manufacturing to evaluate how innovative their approaches to factory automation are, but it's not like they're based solely on turnips: https://www.mondragon-assembly.com/automotive/ https://www.mondragon-assembly.com/automotive/
- mikojan 2y agoThe collective farm that produced SpaceX is the United States Government. It carried out all the research and development necessary to create and further the North American space program. And it is existential in furthering it to this day. Without this source of contracts, research projects and income SpaceX would not be able to produce its commercial spin-off products.
- trhway 2y agoYou obviously never been to a collective farm. Despite government support to the extent much larger than that for SpaceX collective farms have nothing to show for it.
- immibis 2y agoMaybe because they are farms and not rocket makers
- trhway 2y agoWhy they are farms and not rocket makers? Because collective.
- nl 2y agoBut there are very successful rocketry collectives! They just typically aren't called "farms". Things like Friends of Amateur Rocketry have all the characteristics of a collective (including legal status) https://friendsofamateurrocketry.org/ https://friendsofamateurrocketry.org/ The constraining factor is typically budget (as mentioned up-thread).
- immibis 2y agoBy this logic capitalism is the thing holding back capitalist farms from being rocket makers too? Or do you only apply it when you get to use the word "collective"?
- trhway 2y agoOf course it is the logic of collective. In capitalism you decide how you'd want to spend your resources, on a farm or on a rocket. In collective it is collective who decides.
- WalterBright 2y agoIf it weren't for the Wright Brothers, NASA would never have existed.
- mikojan 2y agoMaybe so but I am not arguing with that. The original claim is much weaker: No "collective" produces innovation.
- immibis 2y agoOpen source software
- nl 2y agoThere are multiple Kibbutz in Israel that plant and harvest on time and are the major source of innovation for Israel's AgTech sector (which is only behind the US in terms successful startups).
- throwaway2037 2y ago> most businesses are financed through equity sales Can you explain this more? As I understand, after equity IPO, most companies use debt capital markets to raise money to expand their business.
- __MatrixMan__ 2y agoYou've just changed my brand of flour, thanks.