3 ms·

My money is on some combination of "comppletely made up" to "psychosomatic". We see no better evidence of this than how cops treat fentanyl exposure. Cops act

by jmyeet 2y ago

My money is on some combination of "comppletely made up" to "psychosomatic". We see no better evidence of this than how cops treat fentanyl exposure. Cops act like if they're in the same room as fentanyl they might die. This has been perpetuated in media. Thing is, it's completely made up. Fentanyl is no more dangerous to handle than talcum powder. I mean, don't ingest or inhale the powder. There are no "fumes" however. But the cops themselves believe this to the point that they report oversdoses in the field and have legitimate panic attacks for fear of exposure [1]. Havana Syndrome was suspicious from the go. Just the association with Cuba screams CIA psy op. [1]: https://www.npr.org/2023/05/16/1175726650/fentanyl-police-overdose-misinformation https://www.npr.org/2023/05/16/1175726650/fentanyl-police-ov...

AlbertCory 2y ago
[flagged]
- jsheard 2y ago
  The association with Cuba persists despite the official line now being that personnel in at least 96 different countries have been affected by Havana Syndrome. If it really is a secret weapon by the dastardly Communists then they must be deploying it all around the world, including in many friendly US-allied states, without anyone ever catching them in the act over nearly a decade. That's considerably less plausible than Cuba doing covert shenanigans around an embassy on their own soil.
- jmyeet 2y ago
  > and the people who were interviewed on 60 Minutes? They were made up, too? Some? Yes. Absolutely. But the point of pscyhosomatic symptoms is that it feels real. That person has become so convinced of something that they truly believe in their symptoms. It's not conscious. > You cite all this irrelevant stuff about fentanyl, It's not irrelavent. It shows just how powerful pscyhosomatic symptoms can be. > Or do you have some actual evidence? I don't need evidence. Extraordinary claims require extraodinary evidence. There were various claims with Havana Symdrome like "energy weapons". Even the more realistic "unknown substances" still requires something that wouldn't show up when looked for either in the physical presence of supposed victims or in toxicology. If someone is making the claim that this happened to them, then the onus is on them to produce evidence, not on everyone else to disprove it. So in the fentanyl case, there is motive to lie about it because it makes their job seem more dangerous than it actually is. The peceived danger of fentanyl is used to justify all sorts of things like questionable searches or even not doing your job (for fear of fentanyl exposure). Havana Syndrome has similar motive concerns. Compensation, attention, sympathy, that sort of thing.
  - AlbertCory 2y ago
    I believe there are a number of plausible explanations. Of course if you're intent on denying it ...
- pessimizer 2y ago
  Quit asking people to come up with evidence when you yourself have evidence and know it: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/people-with-havana-syndrome-show-no-brain-damage-or-medical-illness/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/people-with-havan... Respond to what's out there, then ask people to come up with something new. Putting "reasoning" in scare quotes is not an argument. Certainly fentanyl is more relevant than making up from whole cloth a quote about Cuba, then getting upset about it. And how did China get roped in again?
- ks2048 2y ago
  I think the need to produce "actual evidence" (physical) should be placed on those who believe Cuba has a magical weapon previously unknown to modern science.
- nextaccountic 2y ago
  Even if the Havana Syndrome isn't entirely psychosomatic it likely has nothing to do with Cuba (just like the Spanish flu isn't particularly related to Spain). It has been found in other countries as well. (Also, I don't know how the CCP entered the chat)
pessimizer 2y ago
Local news will still put on a crying puking fentanyl cop, and angrily defend the story against every doctor and scientist that objects. They don't care if it's true; if you don't believe it, you're anti-cop and pro-drug.
Mistletoe 2y ago
>Cops act like if they're in the same room as fentanyl they might die. You can't really blame them for thinking this, the DEA actually released this info and a video saying it was true to law enforcement in 2016. https://healthandjusticejournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s40352-021-00163-5 https://healthandjusticejournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/1...
- tehwebguy 2y ago
  DEA is just cops, so yeah you can blame them!
- asadotzler 2y ago
  The DEA, which is, you know, just more "cops"?

by jmyeet 2y ago

AlbertCory 2y ago

[flagged]

jsheard 2y ago
The association with Cuba persists despite the official line now being that personnel in at least 96 different countries have been affected by Havana Syndrome. If it really is a secret weapon by the dastardly Communists then they must be deploying it all around the world, including in many friendly US-allied states, without anyone ever catching them in the act over nearly a decade. That's considerably less plausible than Cuba doing covert shenanigans around an embassy on their own soil.
jmyeet 2y ago
> and the people who were interviewed on 60 Minutes? They were made up, too? Some? Yes. Absolutely. But the point of pscyhosomatic symptoms is that it feels real. That person has become so convinced of something that they truly believe in their symptoms. It's not conscious. > You cite all this irrelevant stuff about fentanyl, It's not irrelavent. It shows just how powerful pscyhosomatic symptoms can be. > Or do you have some actual evidence? I don't need evidence. Extraordinary claims require extraodinary evidence. There were various claims with Havana Symdrome like "energy weapons". Even the more realistic "unknown substances" still requires something that wouldn't show up when looked for either in the physical presence of supposed victims or in toxicology. If someone is making the claim that this happened to them, then the onus is on them to produce evidence, not on everyone else to disprove it. So in the fentanyl case, there is motive to lie about it because it makes their job seem more dangerous than it actually is. The peceived danger of fentanyl is used to justify all sorts of things like questionable searches or even not doing your job (for fear of fentanyl exposure). Havana Syndrome has similar motive concerns. Compensation, attention, sympathy, that sort of thing.
- AlbertCory 2y ago
  I believe there are a number of plausible explanations. Of course if you're intent on denying it ...
pessimizer 2y ago
Quit asking people to come up with evidence when you yourself have evidence and know it: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/people-with-havana-syndrome-show-no-brain-damage-or-medical-illness/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/people-with-havan... Respond to what's out there, then ask people to come up with something new. Putting "reasoning" in scare quotes is not an argument. Certainly fentanyl is more relevant than making up from whole cloth a quote about Cuba, then getting upset about it. And how did China get roped in again?
ks2048 2y ago
I think the need to produce "actual evidence" (physical) should be placed on those who believe Cuba has a magical weapon previously unknown to modern science.
nextaccountic 2y ago
Even if the Havana Syndrome isn't entirely psychosomatic it likely has nothing to do with Cuba (just like the Spanish flu isn't particularly related to Spain). It has been found in other countries as well. (Also, I don't know how the CCP entered the chat)

pessimizer 2y ago

Local news will still put on a crying puking fentanyl cop, and angrily defend the story against every doctor and scientist that objects. They don't care if it's true; if you don't believe it, you're anti-cop and pro-drug.

Mistletoe 2y ago

>Cops act like if they're in the same room as fentanyl they might die. You can't really blame them for thinking this, the DEA actually released this info and a video saying it was true to law enforcement in 2016. https://healthandjusticejournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s40352-021-00163-5 https://healthandjusticejournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/1...

tehwebguy 2y ago
DEA is just cops, so yeah you can blame them!
asadotzler 2y ago
The DEA, which is, you know, just more "cops"?