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It would be nice to see somebody do a device that isn't crippled in terms of hardware and software. In my experience, most hardware companies aren't very good a

It would be nice to see somebody do a device that isn't crippled in terms of hardware and software. In my experience, most hardware companies aren't very good at software and vice versa. Apple seems a rare exception to this rule. I'd love a laptop that I can use outside. Even my current macbook pro isn't that good outside. It kind of works but it's not that comfortable on the eyes. And that's supposed to be a screen that is suitable for this. My kindle on the other hand I can use sitting in the sun wearing sun glasses. Not a problem. Not that I do that a lot, I stick to the shadows. But we've had some nice warm temperatures here in the last few weeks and it sucks having to sit indoors to be able to do work. I'd much rather be in some nice garden or park. I'd probably buy anything with a decent amount of hardware power and a good screen like this. I'm OK installing linux on it. Not a problem. I can deal with external batteries and extension cords if needed. But I need my laptop to be fast and have decent keyboards and touch pads. But it seems all the companies in this space fall in the trap of trying to be Apple and then failing miserably on both the hardware and software front. Slow/outdated CPUs, crippled by anemic amounts of memory, paired with somebody's take on how to do Android, etc. When the screen is just about the only thing about a device that isn't shit, it's still a shit product overall.

fsflover 2y ago
> It would be nice to see somebody do a device that isn't crippled in terms of hardware and software. Have a look at PineNote.
- jillesvangurp 2y ago
  > Powered by a powerful and efficient RK3566 SoC with four A55 cores, and backed by 4GBs of RAM and 128GBs of eMMC storage Exactly what I mean by anemic. The only likable thing in that device is the screen.
  - user_7832 2y ago
    Likely not the reply you were looking for, but in theory a PineNote would be a great "donor" device for modification. For example - get your favorite SBC (Raspberry 5?), figure out how to connect it (likely eDP, documentation shouldn't be hard), make a new shell/body and you're done! ...If you have the technical know-how, time, space, tools and motivation of course. It's not that no one does such stuff (see r/cyberdeck), but yeah admittedly if you're not an engineer it likely isn't the easiest.
- not_your_vase 2y ago
  It has been sold out since years, and the Pine folks said most probably will never make another batch (they complain that it was their worst selling device ever, and they don't want to make any more before full software support). I tried to get one since years for fun. The only one that I found that was also shipped to my place was in China, and the seller asked for $1000 (+shipping) for it. I passed. And slowly giving up on buying one. (Also, with it's RPi3-ish SoC it is not really a laptop replacement)
amarcheschi 2y ago
If we're talking about E ink, it happened to study with a guy who had a boox something and it was really cool, however he mainly used it for notes and for writing, and not for coding. I think they offer a lot of products for various needs, perhaps some of them are backlighted. Boox ultra pro c has an underclocked snapdragon 855 so it shouldn't suck too much, just a little. However, they're not cheap
- SSLy 2y ago
  onyx is know for flagrant disregard of GPL terms around the kernel
  - amarcheschi 2y ago
    Oh, I didn't know that
- paradox460 2y ago
  I use a big boox for sheet music. It works well and supports a rather good app for the purpose (mobile sheets)
mft_ 2y ago
I’m hopeful that the ‘working outdoors’ issue may be solved within a couple of generations of AR glasses. Something that can project one or two virtual monitors at a workable resolution, without totally cutting off the outside world, and while looking roughly like a pair of glasses.
- Terr_ 2y ago
  One problem is going to be selectively darkening pixels within the glass itself to get a decent contrast.
carlosjobim 2y ago
Your best solution right now is the 13 inch Onyx Boox Tab X. Put it in front of your MacBook screen and connect through VNC, or leave the Mac at home. They can't connect through wire. Or wait and see if they release a color version of the same size soon.
- reirob 2y ago
  I have a color Boox tablet, and I am very very disappointed about the colors. Very hard to distinguish many colors and shades. Black and white though is really good.
  - carlosjobim 2y ago
    I have also seen the color eink tablets, and the colors are so dull that you at first glance can take it for grayscale. Even so, I think colors would be very good to have for work and functional purposes, only to distinguish between colors. Certainly not for enjoying them.
orlandohill 2y ago
You could connect your laptop to an e-ink monitor. That's what I do. I've been using a 13.3" Dasung Paperlike HD-FT e-ink monitor since 2020. The refresh rate is fine for reading and writing code, and most websites are easily usable in black and white. I normally use a terminal-based text editor in light-mode with syntax colouring turned off. It's not great for detailed videos, but sometimes it's good enough. Dasung have since released 25.3" monochrome and color e-ink monitors, and a more portable 12" color e-ink monitor. https://shop.dasung.com/ https://shop.dasung.com/
- thelastgallon 2y ago
  Wish it were cheaper. $1600 (closer to 1800 with taxes for most people): https://shop.dasung.com/products/dasung-25-3-e-ink-monitor-paperlike-253 https://shop.dasung.com/products/dasung-25-3-e-ink-monitor-p...
ChrisMarshallNY 2y ago
> most hardware companies aren't very good at software and vice versa This has also been my experience. [SOURCE] Software engineer for hardware companies, for over 30 years.
LtWorf 2y ago
> Even my current macbook pro isn't that good outside Shiny screens are notoriously bad outdoors.
neom 2y ago
This company out of Vancouver Canada is doing some interesting stuff, their V1 device isn't quite what you're looking for, but I'd keep an eye on them, my understanding is what you're looking for is where they are going: https://daylightcomputer.com/ https://daylightcomputer.com/
- trentnix 2y ago
  They are explicitly mentioned in the article. Where they are headed is definitely compelling, but to echo so many other comments, it’s just not quite what I want, yet.
JonChesterfield 2y ago
The Kobo tablet seems to be a straightforward Linux instance running on an arm chip. I think it's going to run arbitrary userspace code just fine.
JonChesterfield 2y ago
> Even my current macbook pro isn't that good outside. There's a hack for that. Involves running a full screen transparent overlay which tricks the OS into letting you turn the screen brightness all the way up. Silly that it's necessary but works very well. I don't remember the name of the program.
- WillAdams 2y ago
  Trying to outbright the sun on a battery powered device just results in displays w/ burnt-in screen elements and a dead battery.
  - JonChesterfield 2y ago
    Leaving the charger connected while doing this is a good idea, yes. Presumably the screen will die eventually, but maybe not if Apple spec'ed it sufficiently well. No hardware lasts forever anyway.
- acallaha 2y ago
  I think you're referring to the Vivid app, which I find works very well for this purpose with recent Macbook Pros: www.getvivid.app
WillAdams 2y ago
I really miss, and worry that I will never be able to replace my Fujitsu Stylistic ST-4110 which had a transflective display (which allowed using it in full-bright, direct sunlight, even at the beach) and a stylus --- closest I came was a Samsung Galaxy Book 12 (which I wasn't able to replace). The problem is, trying to out-bright the sun on a battery-powered device is exactly as stupid as it sounds, and solutions such as transflective displays don't showroom well (someone should build a showroom w/ a light booth which simulates a bright sunny day and invite folks to try to use devices in it w/o shading them). At this point in time, I'm seriously considering switching to a Raspberry Pi 5 as a daily driver (paired w/ a Wacom One 13 gen2 display w/ touch) --- if that display could be supplemented by (or swapped out for) an e-ink or similar daylight viewable pen-enabled display, it would probably push me over the edge (and yes, I've considered just pointing my Kindle Scribe's web browser at a page on the rPi --- if someone has a tool which would allow this to capture stylus input, please let me know).
- throwaway48476 2y ago
  There's a new company whose name I forget making a transflective display tablet.
  - WillAdams 2y ago
    I would be very interested in this, esp. if it runs Linux.
    - tomthe 2y ago
      This one might be interesting for you: https://daylightcomputer.com/ https://daylightcomputer.com/ it has a fast e-ink-type of display. Unfortunately it is expensive and not available.

fsflover 2y ago

> It would be nice to see somebody do a device that isn't crippled in terms of hardware and software. Have a look at PineNote.

jillesvangurp 2y ago
> Powered by a powerful and efficient RK3566 SoC with four A55 cores, and backed by 4GBs of RAM and 128GBs of eMMC storage Exactly what I mean by anemic. The only likable thing in that device is the screen.
- user_7832 2y ago
  Likely not the reply you were looking for, but in theory a PineNote would be a great "donor" device for modification. For example - get your favorite SBC (Raspberry 5?), figure out how to connect it (likely eDP, documentation shouldn't be hard), make a new shell/body and you're done! ...If you have the technical know-how, time, space, tools and motivation of course. It's not that no one does such stuff (see r/cyberdeck), but yeah admittedly if you're not an engineer it likely isn't the easiest.
not_your_vase 2y ago
It has been sold out since years, and the Pine folks said most probably will never make another batch (they complain that it was their worst selling device ever, and they don't want to make any more before full software support). I tried to get one since years for fun. The only one that I found that was also shipped to my place was in China, and the seller asked for $1000 (+shipping) for it. I passed. And slowly giving up on buying one. (Also, with it's RPi3-ish SoC it is not really a laptop replacement)

amarcheschi 2y ago

If we're talking about E ink, it happened to study with a guy who had a boox something and it was really cool, however he mainly used it for notes and for writing, and not for coding. I think they offer a lot of products for various needs, perhaps some of them are backlighted. Boox ultra pro c has an underclocked snapdragon 855 so it shouldn't suck too much, just a little. However, they're not cheap

SSLy 2y ago
onyx is know for flagrant disregard of GPL terms around the kernel
- amarcheschi 2y ago
  Oh, I didn't know that
paradox460 2y ago
I use a big boox for sheet music. It works well and supports a rather good app for the purpose (mobile sheets)

mft_ 2y ago

I’m hopeful that the ‘working outdoors’ issue may be solved within a couple of generations of AR glasses. Something that can project one or two virtual monitors at a workable resolution, without totally cutting off the outside world, and while looking roughly like a pair of glasses.

Terr_ 2y ago
One problem is going to be selectively darkening pixels within the glass itself to get a decent contrast.

carlosjobim 2y ago

Your best solution right now is the 13 inch Onyx Boox Tab X. Put it in front of your MacBook screen and connect through VNC, or leave the Mac at home. They can't connect through wire. Or wait and see if they release a color version of the same size soon.

reirob 2y ago
I have a color Boox tablet, and I am very very disappointed about the colors. Very hard to distinguish many colors and shades. Black and white though is really good.
- carlosjobim 2y ago
  I have also seen the color eink tablets, and the colors are so dull that you at first glance can take it for grayscale. Even so, I think colors would be very good to have for work and functional purposes, only to distinguish between colors. Certainly not for enjoying them.

orlandohill 2y ago

You could connect your laptop to an e-ink monitor. That's what I do. I've been using a 13.3" Dasung Paperlike HD-FT e-ink monitor since 2020. The refresh rate is fine for reading and writing code, and most websites are easily usable in black and white. I normally use a terminal-based text editor in light-mode with syntax colouring turned off. It's not great for detailed videos, but sometimes it's good enough. Dasung have since released 25.3" monochrome and color e-ink monitors, and a more portable 12" color e-ink monitor. https://shop.dasung.com/ https://shop.dasung.com/

thelastgallon 2y ago
Wish it were cheaper. $1600 (closer to 1800 with taxes for most people): https://shop.dasung.com/products/dasung-25-3-e-ink-monitor-paperlike-253 https://shop.dasung.com/products/dasung-25-3-e-ink-monitor-p...

ChrisMarshallNY 2y ago

> most hardware companies aren't very good at software and vice versa This has also been my experience. [SOURCE] Software engineer for hardware companies, for over 30 years.

LtWorf 2y ago

> Even my current macbook pro isn't that good outside Shiny screens are notoriously bad outdoors.

neom 2y ago

This company out of Vancouver Canada is doing some interesting stuff, their V1 device isn't quite what you're looking for, but I'd keep an eye on them, my understanding is what you're looking for is where they are going: https://daylightcomputer.com/ https://daylightcomputer.com/

trentnix 2y ago
They are explicitly mentioned in the article. Where they are headed is definitely compelling, but to echo so many other comments, it’s just not quite what I want, yet.

JonChesterfield 2y ago

The Kobo tablet seems to be a straightforward Linux instance running on an arm chip. I think it's going to run arbitrary userspace code just fine.

JonChesterfield 2y ago

> Even my current macbook pro isn't that good outside. There's a hack for that. Involves running a full screen transparent overlay which tricks the OS into letting you turn the screen brightness all the way up. Silly that it's necessary but works very well. I don't remember the name of the program.

WillAdams 2y ago
Trying to outbright the sun on a battery powered device just results in displays w/ burnt-in screen elements and a dead battery.
- JonChesterfield 2y ago
  Leaving the charger connected while doing this is a good idea, yes. Presumably the screen will die eventually, but maybe not if Apple spec'ed it sufficiently well. No hardware lasts forever anyway.
acallaha 2y ago
I think you're referring to the Vivid app, which I find works very well for this purpose with recent Macbook Pros: www.getvivid.app

WillAdams 2y ago

I really miss, and worry that I will never be able to replace my Fujitsu Stylistic ST-4110 which had a transflective display (which allowed using it in full-bright, direct sunlight, even at the beach) and a stylus --- closest I came was a Samsung Galaxy Book 12 (which I wasn't able to replace). The problem is, trying to out-bright the sun on a battery-powered device is exactly as stupid as it sounds, and solutions such as transflective displays don't showroom well (someone should build a showroom w/ a light booth which simulates a bright sunny day and invite folks to try to use devices in it w/o shading them). At this point in time, I'm seriously considering switching to a Raspberry Pi 5 as a daily driver (paired w/ a Wacom One 13 gen2 display w/ touch) --- if that display could be supplemented by (or swapped out for) an e-ink or similar daylight viewable pen-enabled display, it would probably push me over the edge (and yes, I've considered just pointing my Kindle Scribe's web browser at a page on the rPi --- if someone has a tool which would allow this to capture stylus input, please let me know).

throwaway48476 2y ago
There's a new company whose name I forget making a transflective display tablet.
- WillAdams 2y ago
  I would be very interested in this, esp. if it runs Linux.
  - tomthe 2y ago
    This one might be interesting for you: https://daylightcomputer.com/ https://daylightcomputer.com/ it has a fast e-ink-type of display. Unfortunately it is expensive and not available.