8 ms·

so strange for you to blame this on Musk. Twitter was already super partisan long before he took it over

by nox101 2y ago

JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> Twitter was already super partisan long before he took it over Sure. But Elon changed teams. He used to be bipartisan. But he chose a champion in the aftermath of Covid and--by the looks of it--he's chosen a bad one. (In an alternate universe where Musk stuck to what he's good at, I could see the entire Artemis programme being delegated to SpaceX and a bipartisan adoption of Tesla as America's EV standard bearer. Instead, there is real political capital in creating a rival to SpaceX. And Tesla is going to have to constantly be on the defence against cheap Chinese imports from the Democrats and establishment Republicans.)
- pfannkuchen 2y ago
  I think people see Musk differently from how he actually is. Or at least how he sees himself. He has always said, for many years, that he got into SpaceX to work towards the goal of making humans a multiplanetary species, and he got into electric cars to work towards the goal of having a sustainable energy society. I think he legitimately believes that “the woke mind virus” is an existential threat to our society, and if that threat isn’t addressed then the other goals don’t matter because society will collapse before they can be realized. From a near term business perspective his political actions are dumb, but from a personal motivation perspective they make total sense. Or in other words, Musk is primarily driven by a savior complex, not greed (which is unfortunate for investors).
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    > he legitimately believes that “the woke mind virus” is an existential threat to our society Sure. I don't think he's a hypocrite. He has, however, hyper fixated on a topic that's in vogue in tech circles but totally irrelevant elsewhere. Unlike in technology, where one can credibly fail upwards, doing that in politics comes at the cost of influence. And in this block order we're seeing, tangibly, the consequences of Elon Musk's deteriorating influence.
    - jack_pp 2y ago
      What is this topic that's only in vogue in tech circles? Wokeism?
      - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
        > What is this topic that's only in vogue in tech circles? Wokeism? Wokeism as it pertains to social media's discussion of the woke mind virus. Everyone has an opinion on it. But it's not of practical relevance to most people, certainly not most voters. Sort of like modern art.
        jack_pp 2y ago
        Considering a ton of podcasts talk about it and they're not in the tech bubble I'd say it's a pretty important topic especially in the US.
        JumpCrisscross 2y ago
        > Considering a ton of podcasts talk about it and they're not in the tech bubble I'd say it's a pretty important topic especially in the US Yes, like modern art. It’s talked about a lot. But it’s an obsession of a few and irrelevant to most Americans.
        jack_pp 2y ago
        I don't know man, I'm not even from the US and I meet a lot of people being concerned about wokeism being imported into our country, do you have any proof of your allegations?
        JumpCrisscross 2y ago
        > Considering a ton of podcasts talk about it and they're not in the tech bubble I'd say it's a pretty important topic especially in the US Yes, like modern art. It’s talked about a lot, especially by a particular core who gain money and influence from it. But it’s an obsession of a few and irrelevant to most Americans. It certainly doesn’t build one a national platform.
  - jdietrich 2y ago
    I remember when the Toyota Prius was a potent symbol of everything that was wrong with smug liberals. Lazy comedians still use the Prius as a punchline. Why doesn't a Tesla Model 3 carry the same sort of political baggage? Why don't right-wing conspiracy theorists consider Musk to be part of the "WHO/WEF globalist elite", despite the fact that he's a tech billionaire who is literally trying to plug people's brains into The Matrix and colonise space? By taking sides in a partisan culture war, he has made his core mission essentially non-partisan. Maybe he does really believe all of that stuff about "the woke mind virus", or maybe he realised that he can buy a priceless amount of political capital amongst people who would instinctively hate the goals of his project just by uttering the right incantations.
    - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
      > Why doesn't a Tesla Model 3 carry the same sort of political baggage? When was the last time you were in a red state? Driving an EV of any kind is a strong political statement. > By taking sides in a partisan culture war, he has made his core mission essentially non-partisan Not how partisan affiliation works--think of someone who flip flops from one side to the other. They aren't seen as above the fray or non-partisan. Just unreliable (albeit, usually, useful).
      - deleted 2y ago
        [deleted]
      - skrebbel 2y ago
        > Driving an EV of any kind is a strong political statement. This surprises me (I believe you though!). I've read lots of articles and fun facts lately about how places like Texas go fastest at installing solar panels, because solar is now the cheapest source of energy and all. I'd blatantly assume that those new solar field owners would be charging their cars with their own electricity, also purely for money reasons and not climate/ideological ones.
    - FranzFerdiNaN 2y ago
      Funny thing is that he is poisoning his own well by making leftwing people , who are much more likely to drive an EV, abhor him and Tesla. It’s not only happening in the US but has also started to happen in other countries like Australia.
  - FranzFerdiNaN 2y ago
    He believes the woke mind virus is a threat because he has a trans kid.
    - wkat4242 2y ago
      Yeah so much for supporting your children in their chosen life path :'( Imagine having to completely break contact with your own father because he hates who you are so much :'( https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-61880709 https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-61880709
      - jokethrowaway 2y ago
        [flagged]
        defrost 2y ago
        That's his description of events, as told to Jordan B. Peterson. "The child", now 20, responded that Musk was “cold,” “very quick to anger,” “narcissistic,” and described him as an absent father. and further said that her father’s comments had “crossed a line,” and she countered that he “knew what he was doing when he agreed to her treatment” when she was 16 ~ https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/elon-musk-transgender-daughter-vivian-wilson-interview-rcna163665 https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/elon-musk-transgender... ~ https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/26/business/media/elon-musk-daughter-interview-nbc.html https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/26/business/media/elon-musk-... It's not so cut and dried as you make out, it's a heated issue with strong opinions on either side.
        zoilel 2y ago
        [flagged]
        wkat4242 2y ago
        That only works if you think transsexualism is a fad and people are talked into it. I don't agree and these treatments are not provided lightly.
      - deleted 2y ago
  - kelnos 2y ago
    > I think he legitimately believes that “the woke mind virus” is an existential threat to our society The issue is that many people who feel this way (seemingly Musk included) swing to the other extreme and embrace policy positions that only serve to further support and entrench systemic racism. I'm not always comfortable with the methods and rhetoric of some social justice advocates, but I'm not going to present that as evidence that the movement they support is dangerous and we should strive for social injustice instead.
    - valianteffort 2y ago
      [flagged]
  - janalsncm 2y ago
    > he legitimately believes that “the woke mind virus” is an existential threat to our society If “woke” involves an understanding that media is mostly filtered through large corporations and crafts narratives used to serve the interests of the ruling class, I’m not surprised a billionaire owner of a media company would consider that a problem. Rather than identifying actual problems people are facing, media wastes our time with irrelevant distractions. Don’t worry about the opioid epidemic. Don’t worry about the fact that kids increasingly can’t even read after graduating high school. Don’t worry about corporate consolidation and monopolies. You should be worrying about “wokeism”.
  - lossolo 2y ago
    > I think he legitimately believes that “the woke mind virus” is an existential threat to our society Musk blames 'wokeness' for his daughter rejecting him after he didn't accept who she was. His entire conflict with the left and the 'woke' is centered around this one issue. He can't accept that he was rejected because of what he has done, so he needs someone else to blame and fight with. He bought X as his propaganda tool, he doesn't care about the consequences of his actions on society—he only wants to win. > Musk is primarily driven by a savior complex I don't think that's correct, it seems more likely that he was always driven by an inferiority complex.
    - pfannkuchen 2y ago
      > His entire conflict with the left and the 'woke' is centered around this one issue Extreme doubt. But that is probably the reason why he came out of the closet about his views. I think a lot of people have similar views to his, they just keep quiet. Because, well, look at what happens to you if you don’t.
- crossroadsguy 2y ago
  > Musk stuck to what he's good at Right. And that is?
  - excalibur 2y ago
    Occasional well-thought-out, ambitious, and positive talking points combined with a whole lot of keeping his mouth shut seemed to work pretty well for him.
    - kshri24 2y ago
      [flagged]
      - janalsncm 2y ago
        There’s a difference between what a person is legally allowed to do and what is wise for them to do.
        kshri24 2y ago
        Oh so it is now "wise" to "keep mouth shut". No wonder the West is so screwed. It has a lot of "wise men". Very few, like Elon, who will put their money where their mouth is. What you consider "wise", in this context at least, is basically to just put your head down, accept the diktats of authority, entertain the crazed loonies in society and it is all sunshine and rainbows!
        janalsncm 2y ago
        If you don’t have anything intelligent to say, yes, nothing is usually best. > accept the diktats of authority Is this not what Musk is doing in China? Does he not believe the Chinese have a right to free speech? If he actually cared, he would speak out about it. The fact that he’s choosing Chinese money over human rights, you might say that hurts the West.
        2y ago
- kshri24 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - andy_ppp 2y ago
    I can’t believe people think that the FBI or the Biden and Trump campaigns asking for disinformation to be taken down during an election and the people at Twitter making a call on that request is somehow a smoking gun showing some kind of conspiracy. It’s ridiculous!
    - kshri24 2y ago
      [flagged]
      - the_why_of_y 2y ago
        https://www.techdirt.com/2022/12/07/hello-youve-been-referred-here-because-youre-wrong-about-twitter-and-hunter-bidens-laptop/ https://www.techdirt.com/2022/12/07/hello-youve-been-referre... Firstly, Twitter took that down because it violated their long standing policy against doxxing/posting hacked materials, not for any political reason. Secondly, Twitter leadership realized very quickly that their policy wasn't really designed for this specific event, and within a day they changed the policy and unblocked the posts that they had blocked. And now it's 2 years later and uninformed people still bullshit here about election interference and this being a first amendment issue (Twitter is a private company and can block whatever posts it likes).
        kshri24 2y ago
        > Firstly, Twitter took that down because it violated their long standing policy against doxxing/posting hacked materials, not for any political reason. That was a BS reason chosen by Twitter. Twitter Files exposed that already. You are late. > Secondly, Twitter leadership realized very quickly that their policy wasn't really designed for this specific event, and within a day they changed the policy and unblocked the posts that they had blocked. Yeah you clearly haven't read the Twitter Files. It shows. > And now it's 2 years later and uninformed people still bullshit here about election interference and this being a first amendment issue. Because it clearly was and now even Zuckerberg has come out admitting that it was interference. > (Twitter is a private company and can block whatever posts it likes) Sure. But if FBI is involved, it does not become a Twitter issue alone but it becomes Government censorship through a private company. That is election interference and a first amendment violation.
- torginus 2y ago
  I really effing hate the idea that competition is created not because people with entrepreneurial spirit think they can do what SpaceX does cheaper and better, but because the guy running the show is politically undesirable and untrustworthy.
  - XorNot 2y ago
    But that's not the issue: the issue is that Musk alienated almost the entire core demographic who wanted to buy Tesla's, wanted to support electric cars and were more or less completely primed to freely promote the entire brand. He is a man who owns an electric car company but has been pushing climate change denialism as his political position and supporting politicians who do. There's competition because Tesla is not the dominant prime mover it's valuation implies it should be, and people have sensed - correctly - a market opening. No one I know recommends "buy a Tesla" anymore for your first electric car - they say buy a Hydundai Ioniq or wait for a Chinese brand to get cheaper. People are actively embarrassed to drive Teslas, which in turn means there's a growing market for "anything but a Tesla...". And because of that all of the actual faults of a Tesla are paid that much more scrutiny.
    - jajko 2y ago
      Just a single man representing single family in Switzerland but you are right - I'll never buy anything from Tesla, couldn't care less if they are best or not (no they are not in 2024, novelty wore off some time ago with tons of competition, at least in Europe). He showed his true colors, there is no correction possible, people just don't rewrite their core personality. Support for puttin' and overall war in Ukraine, support for dictators, very bad stance on many societal topics, treats his employees like slaves, proper piece of shit as a parent, utterly childish reactions of an immature boy rather than Man - we haven't seen the worst yet. Brilliance in some aspects means nothing if its dragged down into mud by rest of personality. I know some still worship him for the positives and ignore or even appreciate the rest, I can't and won't.
    - torginus 2y ago
      Tbh, not sure what percentage of Tesla buyers are ideologically motivated, but having tried a couple electric cars, I still believe the Model 3 is the best EV outside the premium segment, period. As for Musk, he's a weird one for sure. He made me realize that I don't know the politics of most CEOs (or even know who they are). Which is just as well, I don't want to ponder in the supermarket whether my bodywash is ideologically consistent with my shampoo.
input_sh 2y ago
Who else is there to blame for Twitter refusing to designate a representative, leading to a ban? I'm sure pre-Musk Twitter wouldn't have lost the entire market in the 7th most populous country.
- extheat 2y ago
  There is much more story that you’re either uninformed about or willfully ignoring. The correct move was to remove people from harms way for decisions they have no control over, hence their staff exit from the country.
  - close04 2y ago
    Musk and his people officially don’t have any control over political decisions taken in any country, be it Brazil, Germany, or even home in the US. And they shouldn’t but by virtue of a ton of money thrown towards politicians, and general US global influence, many times this happens. So your explanation should be rewritten as “remove people from the way of legal consequences from breaking local laws they/Musk can’t control (buy) in their favor”. It sounds like the same thing but it’s the difference between fleeing persecution and fleeing prosecution.
  - ben_w 2y ago
    The threats were themselves due to failing to follow a court order. I'm not qualified to tell if the judge giving them is a partisan hack or not, just like I can't make that distinction with the judges that Musk appears to shop for in the US with what others describe as SLAPP lawsuits. But obeying a judge isn't optional in either case.
    - luckylion 2y ago
      > The threats were themselves due to failing to follow a court order. To the individual representatives of a company? That's very rare, and not common like you make it sound. "The company you're representing in this legal process hasn't complied with my orders so I will have you personally arrested".
blueredmodern 2y ago
[flagged]

so strange for you to blame this on Musk. Twitter was already super partisan long before he took it over

by nox101 2y ago

so strange for you to blame this on Musk. Twitter was already super partisan long before he took it over

> Twitter was already super partisan long before he took it over Sure. But Elon changed teams. He used to be bipartisan. But he chose a champion in the aftermath of Covid and--by the looks of it--he's chosen a bad one. (In an alternate universe where Musk stuck to what he's good at, I could see the entire Artemis programme being delegated to SpaceX and a bipartisan adoption of Tesla as America's EV standard bearer. Instead, there is real political capital in creating a rival to SpaceX. And Tesla is going to have to constantly be on the defence against cheap Chinese imports from the Democrats and establishment Republicans.)

pfannkuchen 2y ago
I think people see Musk differently from how he actually is. Or at least how he sees himself. He has always said, for many years, that he got into SpaceX to work towards the goal of making humans a multiplanetary species, and he got into electric cars to work towards the goal of having a sustainable energy society. I think he legitimately believes that “the woke mind virus” is an existential threat to our society, and if that threat isn’t addressed then the other goals don’t matter because society will collapse before they can be realized. From a near term business perspective his political actions are dumb, but from a personal motivation perspective they make total sense. Or in other words, Musk is primarily driven by a savior complex, not greed (which is unfortunate for investors).
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > he legitimately believes that “the woke mind virus” is an existential threat to our society Sure. I don't think he's a hypocrite. He has, however, hyper fixated on a topic that's in vogue in tech circles but totally irrelevant elsewhere. Unlike in technology, where one can credibly fail upwards, doing that in politics comes at the cost of influence. And in this block order we're seeing, tangibly, the consequences of Elon Musk's deteriorating influence.
  - jack_pp 2y ago
    What is this topic that's only in vogue in tech circles? Wokeism?
    - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
      > What is this topic that's only in vogue in tech circles? Wokeism? Wokeism as it pertains to social media's discussion of the woke mind virus. Everyone has an opinion on it. But it's not of practical relevance to most people, certainly not most voters. Sort of like modern art.
      - jack_pp 2y ago
        Considering a ton of podcasts talk about it and they're not in the tech bubble I'd say it's a pretty important topic especially in the US.
        JumpCrisscross 2y ago
        > Considering a ton of podcasts talk about it and they're not in the tech bubble I'd say it's a pretty important topic especially in the US Yes, like modern art. It’s talked about a lot. But it’s an obsession of a few and irrelevant to most Americans.
        jack_pp 2y ago
        I don't know man, I'm not even from the US and I meet a lot of people being concerned about wokeism being imported into our country, do you have any proof of your allegations?
        JumpCrisscross 2y ago
        > Considering a ton of podcasts talk about it and they're not in the tech bubble I'd say it's a pretty important topic especially in the US Yes, like modern art. It’s talked about a lot, especially by a particular core who gain money and influence from it. But it’s an obsession of a few and irrelevant to most Americans. It certainly doesn’t build one a national platform.
- jdietrich 2y ago
  I remember when the Toyota Prius was a potent symbol of everything that was wrong with smug liberals. Lazy comedians still use the Prius as a punchline. Why doesn't a Tesla Model 3 carry the same sort of political baggage? Why don't right-wing conspiracy theorists consider Musk to be part of the "WHO/WEF globalist elite", despite the fact that he's a tech billionaire who is literally trying to plug people's brains into The Matrix and colonise space? By taking sides in a partisan culture war, he has made his core mission essentially non-partisan. Maybe he does really believe all of that stuff about "the woke mind virus", or maybe he realised that he can buy a priceless amount of political capital amongst people who would instinctively hate the goals of his project just by uttering the right incantations.
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    > Why doesn't a Tesla Model 3 carry the same sort of political baggage? When was the last time you were in a red state? Driving an EV of any kind is a strong political statement. > By taking sides in a partisan culture war, he has made his core mission essentially non-partisan Not how partisan affiliation works--think of someone who flip flops from one side to the other. They aren't seen as above the fray or non-partisan. Just unreliable (albeit, usually, useful).
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
    - skrebbel 2y ago
      > Driving an EV of any kind is a strong political statement. This surprises me (I believe you though!). I've read lots of articles and fun facts lately about how places like Texas go fastest at installing solar panels, because solar is now the cheapest source of energy and all. I'd blatantly assume that those new solar field owners would be charging their cars with their own electricity, also purely for money reasons and not climate/ideological ones.
  - FranzFerdiNaN 2y ago
    Funny thing is that he is poisoning his own well by making leftwing people , who are much more likely to drive an EV, abhor him and Tesla. It’s not only happening in the US but has also started to happen in other countries like Australia.
- FranzFerdiNaN 2y ago
  He believes the woke mind virus is a threat because he has a trans kid.
  - wkat4242 2y ago
    Yeah so much for supporting your children in their chosen life path :'( Imagine having to completely break contact with your own father because he hates who you are so much :'( https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-61880709 https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-61880709
    - jokethrowaway 2y ago
      [flagged]
      - defrost 2y ago
        That's his description of events, as told to Jordan B. Peterson. "The child", now 20, responded that Musk was “cold,” “very quick to anger,” “narcissistic,” and described him as an absent father. and further said that her father’s comments had “crossed a line,” and she countered that he “knew what he was doing when he agreed to her treatment” when she was 16 ~ https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/elon-musk-transgender-daughter-vivian-wilson-interview-rcna163665 https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/elon-musk-transgender... ~ https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/26/business/media/elon-musk-daughter-interview-nbc.html https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/26/business/media/elon-musk-... It's not so cut and dried as you make out, it's a heated issue with strong opinions on either side.
      - zoilel 2y ago
        [flagged]
      - wkat4242 2y ago
        That only works if you think transsexualism is a fad and people are talked into it. I don't agree and these treatments are not provided lightly.
    - deleted 2y ago
- kelnos 2y ago
  > I think he legitimately believes that “the woke mind virus” is an existential threat to our society The issue is that many people who feel this way (seemingly Musk included) swing to the other extreme and embrace policy positions that only serve to further support and entrench systemic racism. I'm not always comfortable with the methods and rhetoric of some social justice advocates, but I'm not going to present that as evidence that the movement they support is dangerous and we should strive for social injustice instead.
  - valianteffort 2y ago
    [flagged]
- janalsncm 2y ago
  > he legitimately believes that “the woke mind virus” is an existential threat to our society If “woke” involves an understanding that media is mostly filtered through large corporations and crafts narratives used to serve the interests of the ruling class, I’m not surprised a billionaire owner of a media company would consider that a problem. Rather than identifying actual problems people are facing, media wastes our time with irrelevant distractions. Don’t worry about the opioid epidemic. Don’t worry about the fact that kids increasingly can’t even read after graduating high school. Don’t worry about corporate consolidation and monopolies. You should be worrying about “wokeism”.
- lossolo 2y ago
  > I think he legitimately believes that “the woke mind virus” is an existential threat to our society Musk blames 'wokeness' for his daughter rejecting him after he didn't accept who she was. His entire conflict with the left and the 'woke' is centered around this one issue. He can't accept that he was rejected because of what he has done, so he needs someone else to blame and fight with. He bought X as his propaganda tool, he doesn't care about the consequences of his actions on society—he only wants to win. > Musk is primarily driven by a savior complex I don't think that's correct, it seems more likely that he was always driven by an inferiority complex.
  - pfannkuchen 2y ago
    > His entire conflict with the left and the 'woke' is centered around this one issue Extreme doubt. But that is probably the reason why he came out of the closet about his views. I think a lot of people have similar views to his, they just keep quiet. Because, well, look at what happens to you if you don’t.
crossroadsguy 2y ago
> Musk stuck to what he's good at Right. And that is?
- excalibur 2y ago
  Occasional well-thought-out, ambitious, and positive talking points combined with a whole lot of keeping his mouth shut seemed to work pretty well for him.
  - kshri24 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - janalsncm 2y ago
      There’s a difference between what a person is legally allowed to do and what is wise for them to do.
      - kshri24 2y ago
        Oh so it is now "wise" to "keep mouth shut". No wonder the West is so screwed. It has a lot of "wise men". Very few, like Elon, who will put their money where their mouth is. What you consider "wise", in this context at least, is basically to just put your head down, accept the diktats of authority, entertain the crazed loonies in society and it is all sunshine and rainbows!
        janalsncm 2y ago
        If you don’t have anything intelligent to say, yes, nothing is usually best. > accept the diktats of authority Is this not what Musk is doing in China? Does he not believe the Chinese have a right to free speech? If he actually cared, he would speak out about it. The fact that he’s choosing Chinese money over human rights, you might say that hurts the West.
        2y ago
kshri24 2y ago
[flagged]
- andy_ppp 2y ago
  I can’t believe people think that the FBI or the Biden and Trump campaigns asking for disinformation to be taken down during an election and the people at Twitter making a call on that request is somehow a smoking gun showing some kind of conspiracy. It’s ridiculous!
  - kshri24 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - the_why_of_y 2y ago
      https://www.techdirt.com/2022/12/07/hello-youve-been-referred-here-because-youre-wrong-about-twitter-and-hunter-bidens-laptop/ https://www.techdirt.com/2022/12/07/hello-youve-been-referre... Firstly, Twitter took that down because it violated their long standing policy against doxxing/posting hacked materials, not for any political reason. Secondly, Twitter leadership realized very quickly that their policy wasn't really designed for this specific event, and within a day they changed the policy and unblocked the posts that they had blocked. And now it's 2 years later and uninformed people still bullshit here about election interference and this being a first amendment issue (Twitter is a private company and can block whatever posts it likes).
      - kshri24 2y ago
        > Firstly, Twitter took that down because it violated their long standing policy against doxxing/posting hacked materials, not for any political reason. That was a BS reason chosen by Twitter. Twitter Files exposed that already. You are late. > Secondly, Twitter leadership realized very quickly that their policy wasn't really designed for this specific event, and within a day they changed the policy and unblocked the posts that they had blocked. Yeah you clearly haven't read the Twitter Files. It shows. > And now it's 2 years later and uninformed people still bullshit here about election interference and this being a first amendment issue. Because it clearly was and now even Zuckerberg has come out admitting that it was interference. > (Twitter is a private company and can block whatever posts it likes) Sure. But if FBI is involved, it does not become a Twitter issue alone but it becomes Government censorship through a private company. That is election interference and a first amendment violation.
torginus 2y ago
I really effing hate the idea that competition is created not because people with entrepreneurial spirit think they can do what SpaceX does cheaper and better, but because the guy running the show is politically undesirable and untrustworthy.
- XorNot 2y ago
  But that's not the issue: the issue is that Musk alienated almost the entire core demographic who wanted to buy Tesla's, wanted to support electric cars and were more or less completely primed to freely promote the entire brand. He is a man who owns an electric car company but has been pushing climate change denialism as his political position and supporting politicians who do. There's competition because Tesla is not the dominant prime mover it's valuation implies it should be, and people have sensed - correctly - a market opening. No one I know recommends "buy a Tesla" anymore for your first electric car - they say buy a Hydundai Ioniq or wait for a Chinese brand to get cheaper. People are actively embarrassed to drive Teslas, which in turn means there's a growing market for "anything but a Tesla...". And because of that all of the actual faults of a Tesla are paid that much more scrutiny.
  - jajko 2y ago
    Just a single man representing single family in Switzerland but you are right - I'll never buy anything from Tesla, couldn't care less if they are best or not (no they are not in 2024, novelty wore off some time ago with tons of competition, at least in Europe). He showed his true colors, there is no correction possible, people just don't rewrite their core personality. Support for puttin' and overall war in Ukraine, support for dictators, very bad stance on many societal topics, treats his employees like slaves, proper piece of shit as a parent, utterly childish reactions of an immature boy rather than Man - we haven't seen the worst yet. Brilliance in some aspects means nothing if its dragged down into mud by rest of personality. I know some still worship him for the positives and ignore or even appreciate the rest, I can't and won't.
  - torginus 2y ago
    Tbh, not sure what percentage of Tesla buyers are ideologically motivated, but having tried a couple electric cars, I still believe the Model 3 is the best EV outside the premium segment, period. As for Musk, he's a weird one for sure. He made me realize that I don't know the politics of most CEOs (or even know who they are). Which is just as well, I don't want to ponder in the supermarket whether my bodywash is ideologically consistent with my shampoo.

input_sh 2y ago

Who else is there to blame for Twitter refusing to designate a representative, leading to a ban? I'm sure pre-Musk Twitter wouldn't have lost the entire market in the 7th most populous country.

extheat 2y ago
There is much more story that you’re either uninformed about or willfully ignoring. The correct move was to remove people from harms way for decisions they have no control over, hence their staff exit from the country.
- close04 2y ago
  Musk and his people officially don’t have any control over political decisions taken in any country, be it Brazil, Germany, or even home in the US. And they shouldn’t but by virtue of a ton of money thrown towards politicians, and general US global influence, many times this happens. So your explanation should be rewritten as “remove people from the way of legal consequences from breaking local laws they/Musk can’t control (buy) in their favor”. It sounds like the same thing but it’s the difference between fleeing persecution and fleeing prosecution.
- ben_w 2y ago
  The threats were themselves due to failing to follow a court order. I'm not qualified to tell if the judge giving them is a partisan hack or not, just like I can't make that distinction with the judges that Musk appears to shop for in the US with what others describe as SLAPP lawsuits. But obeying a judge isn't optional in either case.
  - luckylion 2y ago
    > The threats were themselves due to failing to follow a court order. To the individual representatives of a company? That's very rare, and not common like you make it sound. "The company you're representing in this legal process hasn't complied with my orders so I will have you personally arrested".

blueredmodern 2y ago

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