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Next step, we all wear body cams and they identify people with inappropriate behavior. For every mistake you get a point and with enough point a punishment. S

by croes 2y ago

Next step, we all wear body cams and they identify people with inappropriate behavior. For every mistake you get a point and with enough point a punishment. Sounds familiar.

gruez 2y ago
I mean, that already kinda happens today? Everyone carries a camera in their pocket, and public freakouts are recorded and posted on the internet, leading to social consequences for the person in question.
- monkeywork 2y ago
  Which I also think has been a net negative to the Western world. Billy the dumbass in Gary Indiana does something stupid there he should be held to account by people from there, not posted online and receiving massive attention from the rest of the planet as people get off to their outrage porn online.
tamimio 2y ago
Yeah, I am personally against that as well. Enforcing laws is a police job, not the average citizen's, because they “supposedly” undergo certain training to do that. If everyone started acting like a police officer or reporting insignificant things, it would get chaotic, and it incentivizes people being hostile against each other. The only exception, in my opinion, is someone reporting something that’s substantially bad, like a homicide.
- nox101 2y ago
  reporting is not the same as policing. Telling the police about a crime is the norm. Then the police police based on the report.
  - monkeywork 2y ago
    when you start offering monetary rewards for non-serious crime reporting you end up where the number of reports will outrun the resources of the reviewers and eventually have someone be required to "protest" the report and claim they are innocent putting a burden on them rather than the burden being on the authorities to prove you've done something wrong first. Look at things like DMCA reporting on youtube and how it can be abused.
    - nox101 2y ago
      What's this non serious crime you speak of? It certainly not theft and traffic violations. theft ruins people's lives. traffic violations get people killed. Since 2010, the number of people dying in car accidents has gone up 50% per capita
      - monkeywork 2y ago
        Theft / traffic violations / jaywalking / curfew breaking / or public intoxication type crimes can be handled by police directly - having an incentive program to have people go around recording and reporting this sort of crime if not the sort of world I want to live in. Yes I want those type of crimes punished and enforcement, no I do not want the masses to be working in an "all seeing eye" capacity for that to take place. If you can't understand that the nuance there then I won't have much to discuss with you.
rbalicki 2y ago
I'm honestly surprised that businesses in shady areas don't have ubiquitous cameras around their properties and signs that "just do your crime one block away, that's all I ask". (Presumably that invites vandalism and there are consequently practical issues, but has no one pulled this off?)
- Sebb767 2y ago
  With cars, you have a license plate that will usually lead you to the owner. Identifying some random person, possibly with a hood, on noisy camera night vision is a lot harder; when you don't have a reasonably small pool of suspects, it's basically impossible. Even if it would be possible to identify people with a combination of cell phone area warrants and/or by following all cameras around, this level of effort would be far too high (and too invasive) for small crimes like theft and vandalism.
  - xyzzy123 2y ago
    It's often a small pool of "suspects" though. Like "same group/person it was the last 3 times". I think most camera operators make peace with the idea that randos / one offs probably can't be identified. What really aggravates people is repeated behaviour. Many people who install cameras particularly want to know "am I being targeted" vs "this is a random thing".
- IncreasePosts 2y ago
  Most criminals will just cover their face to avoid CCTV.
lurking_swe 2y ago
you conveniently left out the fact that anyone driving a car or truck is driving a dangerous vehicle that can trivially kill or maim others. Driving is supposed to be a privilege, not a right. That comes with responsibility. How you think this is the same as “being naughty while walking outside” is hilarious to me.
- lurking_swe 2y ago
  however i see your point. i believe this is really a failure of police in our modern society. police don’t take driving incidents seriously! it’s their job after all.
- monkeywork 2y ago
  so if someone is carrying a baseball bat, a knife, or any other sort of weapon that can trivially kill or maim others they should be wearing the body cam?
  - lern_too_spel 2y ago
    They should expect to be filmed in public more than people not carrying weapons. This already happens.
    - monkeywork 2y ago
      Would you have that same viewpoint if the goal of the person with the camera was to setup outside of addiction centers, abortion clinics, strip clubs, casinos, etc and publically identify people anyone coming or going? I mean they are public so should they "expect" to be filmed or should there be some sense of privacy?
      - lern_too_spel 2y ago
        You keep misreading things. First, you thought that people said that people who are committing crimes should wear body cams. Now you think I said that everybody in public should expect to be filmed. Neither of those things are true.

by croes 2y ago

Next step, we all wear body cams and they identify people with inappropriate behavior. For every mistake you get a point and with enough point a punishment. Sounds familiar.

gruez 2y ago

I mean, that already kinda happens today? Everyone carries a camera in their pocket, and public freakouts are recorded and posted on the internet, leading to social consequences for the person in question.

monkeywork 2y ago
Which I also think has been a net negative to the Western world. Billy the dumbass in Gary Indiana does something stupid there he should be held to account by people from there, not posted online and receiving massive attention from the rest of the planet as people get off to their outrage porn online.

tamimio 2y ago

Yeah, I am personally against that as well. Enforcing laws is a police job, not the average citizen's, because they “supposedly” undergo certain training to do that. If everyone started acting like a police officer or reporting insignificant things, it would get chaotic, and it incentivizes people being hostile against each other. The only exception, in my opinion, is someone reporting something that’s substantially bad, like a homicide.

nox101 2y ago
reporting is not the same as policing. Telling the police about a crime is the norm. Then the police police based on the report.
- monkeywork 2y ago
  when you start offering monetary rewards for non-serious crime reporting you end up where the number of reports will outrun the resources of the reviewers and eventually have someone be required to "protest" the report and claim they are innocent putting a burden on them rather than the burden being on the authorities to prove you've done something wrong first. Look at things like DMCA reporting on youtube and how it can be abused.
  - nox101 2y ago
    What's this non serious crime you speak of? It certainly not theft and traffic violations. theft ruins people's lives. traffic violations get people killed. Since 2010, the number of people dying in car accidents has gone up 50% per capita
    - monkeywork 2y ago
      Theft / traffic violations / jaywalking / curfew breaking / or public intoxication type crimes can be handled by police directly - having an incentive program to have people go around recording and reporting this sort of crime if not the sort of world I want to live in. Yes I want those type of crimes punished and enforcement, no I do not want the masses to be working in an "all seeing eye" capacity for that to take place. If you can't understand that the nuance there then I won't have much to discuss with you.

rbalicki 2y ago

I'm honestly surprised that businesses in shady areas don't have ubiquitous cameras around their properties and signs that "just do your crime one block away, that's all I ask". (Presumably that invites vandalism and there are consequently practical issues, but has no one pulled this off?)

Sebb767 2y ago
With cars, you have a license plate that will usually lead you to the owner. Identifying some random person, possibly with a hood, on noisy camera night vision is a lot harder; when you don't have a reasonably small pool of suspects, it's basically impossible. Even if it would be possible to identify people with a combination of cell phone area warrants and/or by following all cameras around, this level of effort would be far too high (and too invasive) for small crimes like theft and vandalism.
- xyzzy123 2y ago
  It's often a small pool of "suspects" though. Like "same group/person it was the last 3 times". I think most camera operators make peace with the idea that randos / one offs probably can't be identified. What really aggravates people is repeated behaviour. Many people who install cameras particularly want to know "am I being targeted" vs "this is a random thing".
IncreasePosts 2y ago
Most criminals will just cover their face to avoid CCTV.

lurking_swe 2y ago

you conveniently left out the fact that anyone driving a car or truck is driving a dangerous vehicle that can trivially kill or maim others. Driving is supposed to be a privilege, not a right. That comes with responsibility. How you think this is the same as “being naughty while walking outside” is hilarious to me.

lurking_swe 2y ago
however i see your point. i believe this is really a failure of police in our modern society. police don’t take driving incidents seriously! it’s their job after all.
monkeywork 2y ago
so if someone is carrying a baseball bat, a knife, or any other sort of weapon that can trivially kill or maim others they should be wearing the body cam?
- lern_too_spel 2y ago
  They should expect to be filmed in public more than people not carrying weapons. This already happens.
  - monkeywork 2y ago
    Would you have that same viewpoint if the goal of the person with the camera was to setup outside of addiction centers, abortion clinics, strip clubs, casinos, etc and publically identify people anyone coming or going? I mean they are public so should they "expect" to be filmed or should there be some sense of privacy?
    - lern_too_spel 2y ago
      You keep misreading things. First, you thought that people said that people who are committing crimes should wear body cams. Now you think I said that everybody in public should expect to be filmed. Neither of those things are true.