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Sad, very sad, but a sign of our times (for some years now). Life around us has/is changing and there are more people interested in their careers and bank accou

Sad, very sad, but a sign of our times (for some years now). Life around us has/is changing and there are more people interested in their careers and bank accounts than life itself and the supporting environment of family, friends, colleagues, relatives... We're going to be seeing this more and more in the coming years :-(

aprilthird2021 2y ago
Sometimes I wonder with all our great progress what did we do wrong if it caused us to stop having kids at replacement rate? I know we can not turn back the clock, but if it were a game of Sims or Civilization, what are the set of choices and progresses we could have made to avoid this outcome
- moffkalast 2y ago
  It's not what we did wrong, it's what we did right: education, contraception, women's rights, new forms of entertainment that are quite literally better than sex. If we wanted to avoid this outcome we'd need to make the world a much worse place than it already is, and if that's really the case then we frankly deserve to go extinct.
  - aprilthird2021 2y ago
    I really don't believe the only options are women's rights or burden our future generations one by one until they die out of collapse
- rawgabbit 2y ago
  Japan's population decline is due to the collapse of the "bubble economy" in the 90s. This resulted in the "Lost Decades" where household incomes fell. This is especially shocking to Japan that had promoted the myth of the "salary man" where you worked for one company for life and are rewarded with lifetime employment. This break of the Japanese social contract left a deep scar on the Japanese psyche. To further complicate things, married women in Japan face social pressure to drop out of the work force after having children. They face an impossible choice of not having children or poverty. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lost_Decades https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lost_Decades
- pjc50 2y ago
  As sibling comment says, this is the outcome of what we did right, and decades of policy programme. We spent the 20th century changing the norm from "women will, from teenagerhood, roll the dice on pregnancy approximately five times with a 2% maternal mortality rate, with the expectation of at least one child not making it to adulthood, and a reasonable chance of experiencing famine at least once in your life" to .. not that. From the 1.65 billion people who entered the 20th century to the approximately 8 billion today. We averted the Malthus catastrophe. With tremendous effort we got the line to dip below replacement rate. Now people are panicking that it will never go up again? How many people do you think they should be on Earth? 8 billion, sixteen, a hundred billion? What does the average megacity look like at that level?
  - aprilthird2021 2y ago
    How can it be the outcome of what we did right when it is leading to shrinking, aging populations struggling to pay for less and less used infrastructure? The only way we are avoiding becoming Japan 2.0 in the West is by immigration, and that's leading to the resurgence of far right politicians in Europe, which turned out very well the first time around. I don't think we should grow the population forever. I also don't think we should shrink so smaller and smaller generations are burdened to pay for the life of older and larger ones.
- lotsofpulp 2y ago
  > what did we do wrong if it caused us to stop having kids at replacement rate? Gave people freedom via women’s rights, a somewhat peaceful society, and birth control. The previously high fertility rates were entirely a consequence of Mother Nature giving men more physical power than women, and women not being able to control their fertility.
  - aprilthird2021 2y ago
    Like I said elsewhere, I don't believe that women's rights alone and as a principle are the issue here. Women don't want society to collapse either.
- anal_reactor 2y ago
  The game is rigged and has always been, but through the entire human history people were too stupid to realize this, and the survival instinct made them, well, survive. Now is the first time ever that common man asked himself the question "Wait what?". We need a new social contract wherein the society actually does take care of an individual, instead of saying "git gud"
- svieira 2y ago
  We were warned: https://www.ewtn.com/catholicism/library/mother-teresa-at-the-national-prayer-breakfast-2714 https://www.ewtn.com/catholicism/library/mother-teresa-at-th...
- Ekaros 2y ago
  What I find so weird about this whole situation that it has been coming for decades. Like at least 20, but probably lot more. And no one has found effective solution.

aprilthird2021 2y ago

Sometimes I wonder with all our great progress what did we do wrong if it caused us to stop having kids at replacement rate? I know we can not turn back the clock, but if it were a game of Sims or Civilization, what are the set of choices and progresses we could have made to avoid this outcome

moffkalast 2y ago
It's not what we did wrong, it's what we did right: education, contraception, women's rights, new forms of entertainment that are quite literally better than sex. If we wanted to avoid this outcome we'd need to make the world a much worse place than it already is, and if that's really the case then we frankly deserve to go extinct.
- aprilthird2021 2y ago
  I really don't believe the only options are women's rights or burden our future generations one by one until they die out of collapse
rawgabbit 2y ago
Japan's population decline is due to the collapse of the "bubble economy" in the 90s. This resulted in the "Lost Decades" where household incomes fell. This is especially shocking to Japan that had promoted the myth of the "salary man" where you worked for one company for life and are rewarded with lifetime employment. This break of the Japanese social contract left a deep scar on the Japanese psyche. To further complicate things, married women in Japan face social pressure to drop out of the work force after having children. They face an impossible choice of not having children or poverty. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lost_Decades https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lost_Decades
pjc50 2y ago
As sibling comment says, this is the outcome of what we did right, and decades of policy programme. We spent the 20th century changing the norm from "women will, from teenagerhood, roll the dice on pregnancy approximately five times with a 2% maternal mortality rate, with the expectation of at least one child not making it to adulthood, and a reasonable chance of experiencing famine at least once in your life" to .. not that. From the 1.65 billion people who entered the 20th century to the approximately 8 billion today. We averted the Malthus catastrophe. With tremendous effort we got the line to dip below replacement rate. Now people are panicking that it will never go up again? How many people do you think they should be on Earth? 8 billion, sixteen, a hundred billion? What does the average megacity look like at that level?
- aprilthird2021 2y ago
  How can it be the outcome of what we did right when it is leading to shrinking, aging populations struggling to pay for less and less used infrastructure? The only way we are avoiding becoming Japan 2.0 in the West is by immigration, and that's leading to the resurgence of far right politicians in Europe, which turned out very well the first time around. I don't think we should grow the population forever. I also don't think we should shrink so smaller and smaller generations are burdened to pay for the life of older and larger ones.
lotsofpulp 2y ago
> what did we do wrong if it caused us to stop having kids at replacement rate? Gave people freedom via women’s rights, a somewhat peaceful society, and birth control. The previously high fertility rates were entirely a consequence of Mother Nature giving men more physical power than women, and women not being able to control their fertility.
- aprilthird2021 2y ago
  Like I said elsewhere, I don't believe that women's rights alone and as a principle are the issue here. Women don't want society to collapse either.
anal_reactor 2y ago
The game is rigged and has always been, but through the entire human history people were too stupid to realize this, and the survival instinct made them, well, survive. Now is the first time ever that common man asked himself the question "Wait what?". We need a new social contract wherein the society actually does take care of an individual, instead of saying "git gud"
svieira 2y ago
We were warned: https://www.ewtn.com/catholicism/library/mother-teresa-at-the-national-prayer-breakfast-2714 https://www.ewtn.com/catholicism/library/mother-teresa-at-th...
Ekaros 2y ago
What I find so weird about this whole situation that it has been coming for decades. Like at least 20, but probably lot more. And no one has found effective solution.