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> by Deloitte and other contractors for more than $400 million—is supposed to analyze income and health information to automatically determine eligibility for b

> by Deloitte and other contractors for more than $400 million—is supposed to analyze income and health information to automatically determine eligibility for benefits program applicants. Ultimately this needs to be weighed against 1. How accurately, corruption free, and expediently would $400M of humans performed compared to the software, and 2. How much better software could have been delivered by Code for America had they been given the $400M in resources. My gut suspicions are 1. Much worse, and 2. Much better

justin66 2y ago
> $400M of humans Weird.
- tomrod 2y ago
  Government procurement contracts in a few ways. Only in small ones or DOD do you see FFP. Larger ones are structured like "work programs" due to laws.
- maerF0x0 2y ago
  yeah, probably "Government Employees" would have come across clearer.
autoexec 2y ago
It should only be weighed against the harms it's caused right now and any company responsible for those harms should face meaningful consequences as a result. It doesn't matter if humans would have done worse in the same situation (something you can't easily prove anyway) the same way we don't weigh the actions of a murderer based on how much more horrifically some other murderer might have killed the victims. We just punish the murderer we have for what they've actually done. Maybe generally software is a good idea, but this software was a total nightmare and it clearly has no place making these decisions.
- maerF0x0 2y ago
  The point is that humans doing the work was the baseline control. If we invested $400M and got something for our money, then it's a good iteration.
gopher_space 2y ago
I mean what would it have cost to just greenlight every applicant?
- maerF0x0 2y ago
  That is also a fantastic comparison point. The same ideal is part of the idea behind UBI replacing the social welfare bureaucracy. I found this documentary "Freedom to choose" to be really interesting: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dngqR9gcDDw&list=PLt27lKoC5LS4wbD28Jkv95UUm9H7wbVO4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dngqR9gcDDw&list=PLt27lKoC5L...

justin66 2y ago

> $400M of humans Weird.

tomrod 2y ago
Government procurement contracts in a few ways. Only in small ones or DOD do you see FFP. Larger ones are structured like "work programs" due to laws.
maerF0x0 2y ago
yeah, probably "Government Employees" would have come across clearer.

autoexec 2y ago

It should only be weighed against the harms it's caused right now and any company responsible for those harms should face meaningful consequences as a result. It doesn't matter if humans would have done worse in the same situation (something you can't easily prove anyway) the same way we don't weigh the actions of a murderer based on how much more horrifically some other murderer might have killed the victims. We just punish the murderer we have for what they've actually done. Maybe generally software is a good idea, but this software was a total nightmare and it clearly has no place making these decisions.

maerF0x0 2y ago
The point is that humans doing the work was the baseline control. If we invested $400M and got something for our money, then it's a good iteration.

gopher_space 2y ago

I mean what would it have cost to just greenlight every applicant?

maerF0x0 2y ago
That is also a fantastic comparison point. The same ideal is part of the idea behind UBI replacing the social welfare bureaucracy. I found this documentary "Freedom to choose" to be really interesting: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dngqR9gcDDw&list=PLt27lKoC5LS4wbD28Jkv95UUm9H7wbVO4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dngqR9gcDDw&list=PLt27lKoC5L...