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So in what way did Telegraph fail to declare the cryptographic services offered? "Certified declaration" implies an authority that certifies it, i.e. approves

So in what way did Telegraph fail to declare the cryptographic services offered? "Certified declaration" implies an authority that certifies it, i.e. approves it, i.e. has to give permission.

yorwba 2y ago
Since the case hasn't yet been adjudicated, I don't know whether or how Telegram failed to provide a certified declaration, but it seems possible that they simply never submitted the form. "Certified declaration" does not imply any authority giving permission, especially not when the original French is "déclaration conforme." You could call it a "declaration fulfilling the legal requirements" instead if you want.
- ETH_start 2y ago
  I find it difficult to imagine that failing to submit a form that does not involve obtaining any kind of approval, would be something you get criminally charged for. To what end would criminal penalties be given for such a benign infraction?
  - sgjohnson 2y ago
    > I find it difficult to imagine that failing to submit a form that does not involve obtaining any kind of approval, would be something you get criminally charged for. Try not filing the taxes in the US. > would be something you get criminally charged for. They clearly just charged him with everything they could think of.
    - ETH_start 2y ago
      Filing taxes is associated with obligations, that you must meet. Encryption being free to employ would not be accompanied by any such obligations.
      - sgjohnson 2y ago
        There are plenty of WW2/Cold-war era laws on the book regarding cryptography in a lot of countries though. Even the US. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Export_of_cryptography_from_the_United_States https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Export_of_cryptography_from_...
        ETH_start 2y ago
        Well then "certified declaration" does imply some restrictions on encryption. You need to employ the encryption in a manner that meets the government requirements.

So in what way did Telegraph fail to declare the cryptographic services offered? "Certified declaration" implies an authority that certifies it, i.e. approves it, i.e. has to give permission.

yorwba 2y ago

Since the case hasn't yet been adjudicated, I don't know whether or how Telegram failed to provide a certified declaration, but it seems possible that they simply never submitted the form. "Certified declaration" does not imply any authority giving permission, especially not when the original French is "déclaration conforme." You could call it a "declaration fulfilling the legal requirements" instead if you want.

ETH_start 2y ago
I find it difficult to imagine that failing to submit a form that does not involve obtaining any kind of approval, would be something you get criminally charged for. To what end would criminal penalties be given for such a benign infraction?
- sgjohnson 2y ago
  > I find it difficult to imagine that failing to submit a form that does not involve obtaining any kind of approval, would be something you get criminally charged for. Try not filing the taxes in the US. > would be something you get criminally charged for. They clearly just charged him with everything they could think of.
  - ETH_start 2y ago
    Filing taxes is associated with obligations, that you must meet. Encryption being free to employ would not be accompanied by any such obligations.
    - sgjohnson 2y ago
      There are plenty of WW2/Cold-war era laws on the book regarding cryptography in a lot of countries though. Even the US. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Export_of_cryptography_from_the_United_States https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Export_of_cryptography_from_...
      - ETH_start 2y ago
        Well then "certified declaration" does imply some restrictions on encryption. You need to employ the encryption in a manner that meets the government requirements.