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Maybe the worst TLDR ever :) Interesting post, even though I don’t understand “Why Rust” because all the reasons cited are not an issue with Julia (eg memory s

Maybe the worst TLDR ever :) Interesting post, even though I don’t understand “Why Rust” because all the reasons cited are not an issue with Julia (eg memory safety). This seems to not be about Julia at all. It just a post of a person who only knew Julia, and is now wanting to learn another language (which happens to be Rust)

samatman 2y ago
That stood out to me as well. The collection of reasons given to prefer Rust to C happens to be completely compatible with preferring Julia to C as well. There's a different collection of reasons which wouldn't have that property (smol binary, suitable for realtime and embedded, etc), but it isn't the ones the author picked.
- miguelraz 2y ago
  Author here! Precisely, the most natural symbiosis for a Julia + Rust combo seems to fill a hard-realtime, critical safety or embedded niche with offline simulation. The Py03 and maturin story is something that we haven't brought to Julia yet and I'd love to have some time to work on a tighter integration story there. For example, getting a hot-reload with Revise.jl and a bindings generator that watches file changes and recompiles and the fly so that a Julia REPL gets updated with the new definitions would be so enviable. I haven't spoken to Tim Holy to see how to string that together but many of the pieces are there.
ssivark 2y ago
I don’t think it’s a case for switching from one to the other. It seems like an intro to rust from someone whose first language was Julia (which is used as the perspective to contrast with).
nurettin 2y ago
Wow I thought it was only me. "Why did you switch?" shouldn't be answered by "this talk, that person's opinion and that powerpoint presentation"
- affinepplan 2y ago
  I don't think this is an article about switching. The author still uses Julia --- he has just learned Rust as well! This is an article about the learning experience and some notable differences and takeaways from the adventure into Rust.
  - miguelraz 2y ago
    Right, back then there weren't as many Rust-inclined people in the Julia community and I felt like writing a trip report for my Julia friends. Now I've done a "From Julia to Rust" workshop at the latest JuliaCon and an accompanying survival guide, so that still ongoing work.
- ayhanfuat 2y ago
  This is not about switching. He mentions his first language was Julia and he became interested in learning Rust. He answers that question and there is nothing wrong with someone getting interested in something by watching talks and getting inspired by people's opinions.
  - miguelraz 2y ago
    Yup, this was exactly my reasoning.
  - nurettin 2y ago
    I get inspired by things on their own merits and properties. So getting inspired by others sounds like a bunch of romantic LinkedIn grifter BS. Sorry.
acomjean 2y ago
There is a good list of Rust learning resources though… I’ll agree that it’s mostly about its like using Rust compared to Julia. It’s not very dismissive of Julia. The first paragraph lets you know what your in for.
SkiFire13 2y ago
> are not an issue with Julia (eg memory safety) Note that Julia does allow memory unsafety, for example you can mark array accesses with `@inbounds` to remove bound checks, kinda like how you can use `unsafe` in Rust except it looks much less scary. It also doesn't help that the official example for how to use it safe was actually not safe [1]. Granted, this is just a single example and has been fixed since then, but it doesn't give a nice impression of their mindset when dealing with memory safety. More in general there doesn't seem to be a strong mindset for correctness either. See [2] for a collection of such issues. [1]: https://github.com/JuliaLang/julia/issues/39367 https://github.com/JuliaLang/julia/issues/39367 [2]: https://yuri.is/not-julia/ https://yuri.is/not-julia/

samatman 2y ago

That stood out to me as well. The collection of reasons given to prefer Rust to C happens to be completely compatible with preferring Julia to C as well. There's a different collection of reasons which wouldn't have that property (smol binary, suitable for realtime and embedded, etc), but it isn't the ones the author picked.

miguelraz 2y ago
Author here! Precisely, the most natural symbiosis for a Julia + Rust combo seems to fill a hard-realtime, critical safety or embedded niche with offline simulation. The Py03 and maturin story is something that we haven't brought to Julia yet and I'd love to have some time to work on a tighter integration story there. For example, getting a hot-reload with Revise.jl and a bindings generator that watches file changes and recompiles and the fly so that a Julia REPL gets updated with the new definitions would be so enviable. I haven't spoken to Tim Holy to see how to string that together but many of the pieces are there.

ssivark 2y ago

I don’t think it’s a case for switching from one to the other. It seems like an intro to rust from someone whose first language was Julia (which is used as the perspective to contrast with).

nurettin 2y ago

Wow I thought it was only me. "Why did you switch?" shouldn't be answered by "this talk, that person's opinion and that powerpoint presentation"

affinepplan 2y ago
I don't think this is an article about switching. The author still uses Julia --- he has just learned Rust as well! This is an article about the learning experience and some notable differences and takeaways from the adventure into Rust.
- miguelraz 2y ago
  Right, back then there weren't as many Rust-inclined people in the Julia community and I felt like writing a trip report for my Julia friends. Now I've done a "From Julia to Rust" workshop at the latest JuliaCon and an accompanying survival guide, so that still ongoing work.
ayhanfuat 2y ago
This is not about switching. He mentions his first language was Julia and he became interested in learning Rust. He answers that question and there is nothing wrong with someone getting interested in something by watching talks and getting inspired by people's opinions.
- miguelraz 2y ago
  Yup, this was exactly my reasoning.
- nurettin 2y ago
  I get inspired by things on their own merits and properties. So getting inspired by others sounds like a bunch of romantic LinkedIn grifter BS. Sorry.

acomjean 2y ago

There is a good list of Rust learning resources though… I’ll agree that it’s mostly about its like using Rust compared to Julia. It’s not very dismissive of Julia. The first paragraph lets you know what your in for.

SkiFire13 2y ago

> are not an issue with Julia (eg memory safety) Note that Julia does allow memory unsafety, for example you can mark array accesses with `@inbounds` to remove bound checks, kinda like how you can use `unsafe` in Rust except it looks much less scary. It also doesn't help that the official example for how to use it safe was actually not safe [1]. Granted, this is just a single example and has been fixed since then, but it doesn't give a nice impression of their mindset when dealing with memory safety. More in general there doesn't seem to be a strong mindset for correctness either. See [2] for a collection of such issues. [1]: https://github.com/JuliaLang/julia/issues/39367 https://github.com/JuliaLang/julia/issues/39367 [2]: https://yuri.is/not-julia/ https://yuri.is/not-julia/