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> Our countrymen begged on their knees for the military to intervene only to be arrested and placed in a concentration camp as political prisoners while their "

> Our countrymen begged on their knees for the military to intervene only to be arrested and placed in a concentration camp as political prisoners while their "hero" abandoned them like the cowardly rat he is. Let me get this straight, you mean to say that Bolsonaro's mistake was not taking these protests far enough?

matheusmoreira 2y ago
I mean to say I feel extremely sad for my countrymen who cared far too much about this cursed land and who ended up betrayed in literally every way. Betrayed by the military they put their faith in. Betrayed by the politician they believed in. Wouldn't be surprised if they still liked the guy despite it all. Whether it was a mistake or not, I dunno. I just don't fault him for trying whatever clumsy thing it is that he tried. I don't fault him because I don't believe this country is a democracy. I think it's a judiciary dictatorship. Watching those unelected judges say the word "democracy" actually makes me cringe.
- gchamonlive 2y ago
  Our views from democracy and the current state of things is very different I don't know how to reconcile them. I don't think this is how democracy is done. You don't just bully yourself into power when there is a crisis, however long it is. And there isn't such a thing as a judiciary dictatorship, not when you have a conservative controlled and disproportionately empowered congress and an executive power without governability. What we have is a democratic crisis that must be solved through democratic means. Whatever distorted view of nationalism and the role of the military forces is just a smokescreen for partisans trying to seize power and failing. EDIT: I lay out in my blog a bit of what I think is the correct path in starting to defuse this democratic crisis we see worldwide at the individual level https://xd1.dev/2024/07/against-political-realism https://xd1.dev/2024/07/against-political-realism
  - matheusmoreira 2y ago
    > Our views from democracy and the current state of things is very different I don't know how to reconcile them. I don't know either. This is often my experience trying to discuss this. For what its worth I will read your blog and try to better understand your position. > You don't just bully yourself into power when there is a crisis, however long it is. Who are we supposed to turn to when the Surpeme Court grants itself limitless powers? Gives itself the right to be the victim, investigator, prosecutor and judge? Starts creatively interpreting and selectively applying the constitution of the nation? Basically doing whatever they want, backed by the fact their pens move armed police forces? It's the supreme court. There is no higher court you can appeal to. Is there anyone you can turn to? Anyone other than the military? Which is actually listed as the "moderating power" that's meant to intervene in exactly such extreme situations? I don't have a good answer to that. No one has has ever been able to give me the answer either. That's why I don't fault those folks for asking for military intervention. I don't believe there is a democratic solution to this because the supreme court is not actually a democratic institution to begin with. They are not elected by us, they are appointed by our representatives. Once in the supreme court, their mandates are lifetime. Short of suffering impeachment by the other politicians, they're basically untouchable. There is a 100% chance that the politicians who can impeach them are hopelessly corrupt though, I seriously doubt they're gonna screw around with judges who can put them in the ground.
    - gchamonlive 2y ago
      > I don't have a good answer to that. No one has has ever been able to give me the answer either. That's why I don't fault those folks for asking for military intervention. If we had went through all the due process for debating and processing these issues in the public sphere I would tend to agree. Or if it reached such catastrophic outcomes as we have seen in other countries. However we went from a mostly systemically dysfunctional government, which is very common, to having fear and despair unilaterally incited by Bolsonaro. When he blames all the issues on communism and the workers party, incite people to kill the opposition, which some supporters took to the extreme of actually gunning down people celebrating the election, spend the entire time in power questioning the election system without actually improving it, we skip the entire democratic process without giving it a chance to work. Yes, the workers party spent almost four mandates and nothing changed. But brazillian democracy itself is quite young, it's not even 40 years old. Things take a while to get better, and we already see our democratic institutions get better over time. After saying all that I kind of agree that these folks asking for military intervention aren't all at fault. I think they are victims of a strategy of fear Bolsonaro used to gain power. However, I don't think that movement is legitimate and I think if not for the judicial system we might have had way worse problems to worry about than Moraes having talked to two assessors when investigating rioters, or having Moraes close down X for not complying with sovereign country laws. We might even see investigations against de Moraes, just as we have seen against Moro. We have precedence for this.

matheusmoreira 2y ago

I mean to say I feel extremely sad for my countrymen who cared far too much about this cursed land and who ended up betrayed in literally every way. Betrayed by the military they put their faith in. Betrayed by the politician they believed in. Wouldn't be surprised if they still liked the guy despite it all. Whether it was a mistake or not, I dunno. I just don't fault him for trying whatever clumsy thing it is that he tried. I don't fault him because I don't believe this country is a democracy. I think it's a judiciary dictatorship. Watching those unelected judges say the word "democracy" actually makes me cringe.

gchamonlive 2y ago
Our views from democracy and the current state of things is very different I don't know how to reconcile them. I don't think this is how democracy is done. You don't just bully yourself into power when there is a crisis, however long it is. And there isn't such a thing as a judiciary dictatorship, not when you have a conservative controlled and disproportionately empowered congress and an executive power without governability. What we have is a democratic crisis that must be solved through democratic means. Whatever distorted view of nationalism and the role of the military forces is just a smokescreen for partisans trying to seize power and failing. EDIT: I lay out in my blog a bit of what I think is the correct path in starting to defuse this democratic crisis we see worldwide at the individual level https://xd1.dev/2024/07/against-political-realism https://xd1.dev/2024/07/against-political-realism
- matheusmoreira 2y ago
  > Our views from democracy and the current state of things is very different I don't know how to reconcile them. I don't know either. This is often my experience trying to discuss this. For what its worth I will read your blog and try to better understand your position. > You don't just bully yourself into power when there is a crisis, however long it is. Who are we supposed to turn to when the Surpeme Court grants itself limitless powers? Gives itself the right to be the victim, investigator, prosecutor and judge? Starts creatively interpreting and selectively applying the constitution of the nation? Basically doing whatever they want, backed by the fact their pens move armed police forces? It's the supreme court. There is no higher court you can appeal to. Is there anyone you can turn to? Anyone other than the military? Which is actually listed as the "moderating power" that's meant to intervene in exactly such extreme situations? I don't have a good answer to that. No one has has ever been able to give me the answer either. That's why I don't fault those folks for asking for military intervention. I don't believe there is a democratic solution to this because the supreme court is not actually a democratic institution to begin with. They are not elected by us, they are appointed by our representatives. Once in the supreme court, their mandates are lifetime. Short of suffering impeachment by the other politicians, they're basically untouchable. There is a 100% chance that the politicians who can impeach them are hopelessly corrupt though, I seriously doubt they're gonna screw around with judges who can put them in the ground.
  - gchamonlive 2y ago
    > I don't have a good answer to that. No one has has ever been able to give me the answer either. That's why I don't fault those folks for asking for military intervention. If we had went through all the due process for debating and processing these issues in the public sphere I would tend to agree. Or if it reached such catastrophic outcomes as we have seen in other countries. However we went from a mostly systemically dysfunctional government, which is very common, to having fear and despair unilaterally incited by Bolsonaro. When he blames all the issues on communism and the workers party, incite people to kill the opposition, which some supporters took to the extreme of actually gunning down people celebrating the election, spend the entire time in power questioning the election system without actually improving it, we skip the entire democratic process without giving it a chance to work. Yes, the workers party spent almost four mandates and nothing changed. But brazillian democracy itself is quite young, it's not even 40 years old. Things take a while to get better, and we already see our democratic institutions get better over time. After saying all that I kind of agree that these folks asking for military intervention aren't all at fault. I think they are victims of a strategy of fear Bolsonaro used to gain power. However, I don't think that movement is legitimate and I think if not for the judicial system we might have had way worse problems to worry about than Moraes having talked to two assessors when investigating rioters, or having Moraes close down X for not complying with sovereign country laws. We might even see investigations against de Moraes, just as we have seen against Moro. We have precedence for this.