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Read the charging document. Complicity - Administration of an online platform to allow an illegal transaction in an organised band, - Refusal to communicate,

by hn1986 2y ago

Read the charging document. Complicity - Administration of an online platform to allow an illegal transaction in an organised band, - Refusal to communicate, at the request of the authorised authorities, the information or documents necessary for the realisation and exploitation of interceptions authorised by law, - Complicity - Detention of the image of a minor of a child-pornographic nature, - Complicity - Dissemination, offer or making available in an organised tape of images of a minor of a pornographic nature, - Complicity - Acquisition, transport, holding, offer or disposal of narcotic products, - Complicity - Offer, assignment or making available without legitimate reason of equipment, an instrument, a program or data designed or adapted for the attack and access to the operation of an automated data processing system, - Complicity - Organised gang scam, - Association of criminals with a view to committing a crime or offence punishable by 5 years of imprisonment at least, - Money laundering of crimes or offences in organised gangs, - Provision of cryptology services to ensure confidentiality functions without a declaration of conformity, - Provision of a cryptological means not exclusively ensuring authentication or integrity control functions without prior declaration, - Import of a cryptology means that does not exclusively perform authentication or integrity control functions without prior declaration.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago
Those are allegations. Durov being directly involved with CSAM in any way is not something I've seen substantiated.
- hn1986 2y ago
  Involved with CSAM means having a platform that openly has CSAM and not doing anything about it despite many warnings and requests in years. Do you disagree that is illegal? See my examples of others being charged...
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    > Involved with CSAM means having a platform that openly has CSAM and not doing anything about it despite many warnings and requests in years You'd have to show that he knew about specific instances and declined to intervene. I'm not saying that's unlikely. But I haven't seen it shown, and I suspect part of what the French police are trying to get is that evidence of wilful inaction versus gross negligence.
    - vajrabum 2y ago
      So in your view it's perfectly ok to run an internet service where you don't check for CSAM? You're entitled to that view I suppose but it's a minority view and allowing CSAM on your platform is illegal in most places (including the US where there's a carve out for that sort of stuff in the law that protects Google, Facebook et al) and in all of those jurisdictions the public is not going to be able to see the CSAM or be able to examine the substance of the allegations either before or during trial. Every social network or file sharing site that I've been aware of has a Trust and Safety department for just this reason even X. The executives don't want to go to jail.
      - emptysongglass 2y ago
        > So in your view it's perfectly ok to run an internet service where you don't check for CSAM? Well, that's quite the assumption. The commenter you've replied to said nothing like this. And yet this is your first conclusion?? Is this how you operate in real life, at your job? Telegram does moderate for CSAM. The claim that it does not is completely unsubstantiated. You can find CSAM across Meta's products. Does that mean they do not check for CSAM? No.
        hn1986 2y ago
        They ignore taking action when confronted with it. That's why Durov is a disgusting human being. "the app had gained a reputation for ignoring advocacy groups fighting child exploitation. Three of those groups, the U.S.-based National Center for Missing & Exploited Children (NCMEC), the Canadian Centre for Child Protection and the U.K.-based Internet Watch Foundation, all told NBC News that their outreach to Telegram about child sexual abuse material, often shorthanded as CSAM, on the platform has largely been ignored."

by hn1986 2y ago

JumpCrisscross 2y ago

Those are allegations. Durov being directly involved with CSAM in any way is not something I've seen substantiated.

hn1986 2y ago
Involved with CSAM means having a platform that openly has CSAM and not doing anything about it despite many warnings and requests in years. Do you disagree that is illegal? See my examples of others being charged...
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > Involved with CSAM means having a platform that openly has CSAM and not doing anything about it despite many warnings and requests in years You'd have to show that he knew about specific instances and declined to intervene. I'm not saying that's unlikely. But I haven't seen it shown, and I suspect part of what the French police are trying to get is that evidence of wilful inaction versus gross negligence.
  - vajrabum 2y ago
    So in your view it's perfectly ok to run an internet service where you don't check for CSAM? You're entitled to that view I suppose but it's a minority view and allowing CSAM on your platform is illegal in most places (including the US where there's a carve out for that sort of stuff in the law that protects Google, Facebook et al) and in all of those jurisdictions the public is not going to be able to see the CSAM or be able to examine the substance of the allegations either before or during trial. Every social network or file sharing site that I've been aware of has a Trust and Safety department for just this reason even X. The executives don't want to go to jail.
    - emptysongglass 2y ago
      > So in your view it's perfectly ok to run an internet service where you don't check for CSAM? Well, that's quite the assumption. The commenter you've replied to said nothing like this. And yet this is your first conclusion?? Is this how you operate in real life, at your job? Telegram does moderate for CSAM. The claim that it does not is completely unsubstantiated. You can find CSAM across Meta's products. Does that mean they do not check for CSAM? No.
      - hn1986 2y ago
        They ignore taking action when confronted with it. That's why Durov is a disgusting human being. "the app had gained a reputation for ignoring advocacy groups fighting child exploitation. Three of those groups, the U.S.-based National Center for Missing & Exploited Children (NCMEC), the Canadian Centre for Child Protection and the U.K.-based Internet Watch Foundation, all told NBC News that their outreach to Telegram about child sexual abuse material, often shorthanded as CSAM, on the platform has largely been ignored."