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How is that a lie? It's not possible to make group chats with cross-device history end-to-end encrypted. If you don't like that feature, don't use it, stick to

How is that a lie? It's not possible to make group chats with cross-device history end-to-end encrypted. If you don't like that feature, don't use it, stick to e2e encrypted DM's. You're saying they are lying because they offer more than just e2e encrypted DM's?

attendant3446 2y ago
I say they lie about being secure because they're not secure by default. It's an option, and a very inconvenient one. Plenty of other messengers have made e2e encryption easy to use. Telegram has done the opposite, which makes me think that they don't want their users to use truly private messages.
- kgeist 2y ago
  How hard is it to tap on "New secret chat"? In my Android client all I need to do is to tap on the large blue icon in the bottom right corner, choose "New secret chat" (other options: "New group" and "New channel", basically your go-to button for creating new groups/channels), then choose the person. Isn't it basically how you usually create chats in every other messenger? In WhatsApp, you also click on a large green icon in the bottom right corner, with the options being "New group", "New contact" and "New community". In Viber, you click on a large purple icon in the bottom right corner, with the options being "New Group", "New Community", "New Channel". The security researcher cited in the article used a different flow by going to an existing contact's profile first and opening the hamburger menu there, and claimed the feature is "hidden" because of that (the hamburger menu), when in fact it isn't. Maybe it's different on iOS though, I don't know.
  - fsflover 2y ago
    > How hard is it to tap on "New secret chat"? Try to do it on a desktop Linux. There is no such option.
  - attendant3446 2y ago
    AFAIK, the main reason why people don't use these "secret chats" in Telegram is that the history stays on one device. It doesn't have to go to the cloud, but you can synchronise it with already linked devices by sharing your keys. As if it was deliberately made inconvenient to use, "encryption brings limitations, it's easier to upload everything to our cloud, trust us".
fsflover 2y ago
> It's not possible to make group chats with cross-device history end-to-end encrypted. I am using it on Matrix just fine.

attendant3446 2y ago

I say they lie about being secure because they're not secure by default. It's an option, and a very inconvenient one. Plenty of other messengers have made e2e encryption easy to use. Telegram has done the opposite, which makes me think that they don't want their users to use truly private messages.

kgeist 2y ago
How hard is it to tap on "New secret chat"? In my Android client all I need to do is to tap on the large blue icon in the bottom right corner, choose "New secret chat" (other options: "New group" and "New channel", basically your go-to button for creating new groups/channels), then choose the person. Isn't it basically how you usually create chats in every other messenger? In WhatsApp, you also click on a large green icon in the bottom right corner, with the options being "New group", "New contact" and "New community". In Viber, you click on a large purple icon in the bottom right corner, with the options being "New Group", "New Community", "New Channel". The security researcher cited in the article used a different flow by going to an existing contact's profile first and opening the hamburger menu there, and claimed the feature is "hidden" because of that (the hamburger menu), when in fact it isn't. Maybe it's different on iOS though, I don't know.
- fsflover 2y ago
  > How hard is it to tap on "New secret chat"? Try to do it on a desktop Linux. There is no such option.
- attendant3446 2y ago
  AFAIK, the main reason why people don't use these "secret chats" in Telegram is that the history stays on one device. It doesn't have to go to the cloud, but you can synchronise it with already linked devices by sharing your keys. As if it was deliberately made inconvenient to use, "encryption brings limitations, it's easier to upload everything to our cloud, trust us".

fsflover 2y ago

> It's not possible to make group chats with cross-device history end-to-end encrypted. I am using it on Matrix just fine.