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Requiring photo id to vote would at least remove the risk of voter fraud with this data breach. I'm also surprised that the company responded accordingly to th

Requiring photo id to vote would at least remove the risk of voter fraud with this data breach. I'm also surprised that the company responded accordingly to the breach with only a day turn around time.

jmyeet 2y ago
"Voter ID" has become an issue for the political right in the US despite there being no evidence of a widespread voter fraud problem and the majority of offenders seem to vote Republican [1]. So you need to ask yourself when you see this: why would the Republicans push for Voter ID? Yes, it helps with the fabricated narrative about a "stolen election" but there's a deeper reason and it's not election integrity. It's voter suppression. As soon as you require a government-isseud ID to vote, you then get into the questions of which IDs qualify and how hard or expensive are they to get it. Consider counties in Alabama where the DMV was only open one day a month [2]. Or that voter ID laws disproortionately impact Native Americans [3]. Or that student IDs are often excluded as valid voter IDs [4]. I would support broader election reform that includes: 1. IDs issued by the Federal government at no cost that are easy to get; 2. Expanded access to voting. This means early voting, universal access to voting by mail with no justification required whatsoever and (ideally) moving voting day to a weekend; 3. Mandatory voting. That doesn't mean you have to vote at all. It just means you have to put a ballot into a box, even if empty or spoiled, or to mail one in. This is essentially the system in Australia; 4. Ranked-choice voting; 5. Congressional seats decided by proportional representation rather than FPTP districts; and 6. Senate seats per state being decided in terms of population size, say 1-3 depending on size. Then sure, let's have voter ID. [1]: https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/republicans-voter-fraud-convictions-2024-rcna146434 https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/republicans-vote... [2]: https://www.al.com/news/montgomery/2016/12/feds_alabama_to_expand_drivers.html https://www.al.com/news/montgomery/2016/12/feds_alabama_to_e... [3]: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10624504/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10624504/ [4]: https://www.insidehighered.com/news/students/free-speech/2023/07/07/bans-student-ids-voting-proposed-five-states https://www.insidehighered.com/news/students/free-speech/202...
- epoxia 2y ago
  We can have voter ID once we get a proper national ID to replaces Social insecurity numbers.
  - hindsightbias 2y ago
    That would lead to the “mark of the beast” and anti-govt crowd never voting again, which would be fine, but hypocritical for any voting advocate.
    - nozzlegear 2y ago
      I'm only vaguely familiar with the "mark of the beast" stuff from my catechism days as a kid. Isn't it supposed to be a tattoo or physical mark on the body? How would the proposed national ID differ from the social security number we already receive?
      - MisterBastahrd 2y ago
        It's whatever these luddites dream up in their intelligence-stricken skulls. It also changes depending on the day of the week and the direction of the wind. For example, our current credit system is much closer to "mark of the beast" level stuff than a society where everything is paid for with physical cash, but the same people who are afraid of the mark are fine with credit cards because it keeps undesirables away from them. The truly destitute are not going to have a credit card most of the time, and if they do it's because they're cashing checks through a payday lender who keeps 3% of their income plus a service fee in order to keep their account.
  - jimbob45 2y ago
    Elections are state-run. You shouldn’t need a national ID to vote in a state-run election. You should only need a state-issued ID. The best thing to come out of Bush v Gore was the reinforcement of elections being state-run.
- jimbob45 2y ago
cyanydeez 2y ago
As soon as you make both voting and getting id free and paid timeoff or holiday, great. But thats never how voter id laws in america aee proposed, and as such, they are the same as antivoter laws.
- ImJamal 2y ago
  As far as I can tell, every state that has voter id also provides free IDs. They don't have PTO or holidays though.
  - blululu 2y ago
    Can't speak to the other 49 states, but California does have a legal requirement for taking time off to vote on Election Day. We also have polling stations that are open in the days before the election so I was able to simply vote on a Saturday morning in the last election which feels like a solid policy.
    - WaitWaitWha 2y ago
      California also has a requirement that ID for any traffic violation, including non-vehicular ones must be shown. Which makes ID ownership and carrying one at all the time a de facto requirement in CA. With the REAL ID Act of 2005, most of the State ID cards (not just driver's licenses) are REAL ID-compliant, meaning they can be used for any state and Federal identification. Some fees: New York: $9.00 - $13.00 (varies based on age and duration of the card). For individuals under 62, the standard fee is $13.00 for an 8-year ID. Those 62 or older with Supplemental Security Income (SSI) can get it for $6.50. Texas: $16.00. The ID card is valid for six years. Reduced fees are available for individuals aged 60 or older and those who are disables. Florida: $25.00. This is the standard fee for a Florida ID card. The card is valid for eight years. The state offers free ID cards to individuals who are homeless or are 100% disabled vets California: $38.00. The fee for a regular ID card in California is $38.00. However, the state offers free ID cards to low-income individuals, seniors, and those who are homeless under specific programs
      - 2y ago
choward 2y ago
Mail out ballots then require an ID when you turn it in. Make it easier to get an ID if that's a problem. It seems pretty simple to me. Not sure why anyone would be against this.
- jeffbee 2y ago
  We're against it because allowing ten thousand unelected petty bureaucrats to adjudicate whether a voter is or is not allowed to cast their ballot on election day isn't a good system.
  - weaksauce 2y ago
    to anyone wondering what this looks like in practice... google "hanging chad"
- sandworm101 2y ago
  > Not sure why anyone would be against this. Because of all the edge cases. Some people do not have ID. Some have ID but it doesn't match their current address. Some people have ID but the same name+address as a dead person (not uncommon when people inherit houses from dead parents). Most people would be fine with ID requirements if they could trust that these edge cases will not be leveraged by some local volunteer with an agenda. In the never-ending 50-50 split of US politics, edge cases are too often the decider. See Florida 2000, where those who couldn't properly punch a hole in a piece of paper ended up deciding the presidency.
- philipov 2y ago
  > Make it easier to get an ID if that's a problem. ... Not sure why anyone would be against this. Because the same people trying to make IDs required also want them to be harder to get, not easier.
  - mminer237 2y ago
    I have never heard of anyone pushing to make IDs harder to get.

jmyeet 2y ago

"Voter ID" has become an issue for the political right in the US despite there being no evidence of a widespread voter fraud problem and the majority of offenders seem to vote Republican [1]. So you need to ask yourself when you see this: why would the Republicans push for Voter ID? Yes, it helps with the fabricated narrative about a "stolen election" but there's a deeper reason and it's not election integrity. It's voter suppression. As soon as you require a government-isseud ID to vote, you then get into the questions of which IDs qualify and how hard or expensive are they to get it. Consider counties in Alabama where the DMV was only open one day a month [2]. Or that voter ID laws disproortionately impact Native Americans [3]. Or that student IDs are often excluded as valid voter IDs [4]. I would support broader election reform that includes: 1. IDs issued by the Federal government at no cost that are easy to get; 2. Expanded access to voting. This means early voting, universal access to voting by mail with no justification required whatsoever and (ideally) moving voting day to a weekend; 3. Mandatory voting. That doesn't mean you have to vote at all. It just means you have to put a ballot into a box, even if empty or spoiled, or to mail one in. This is essentially the system in Australia; 4. Ranked-choice voting; 5. Congressional seats decided by proportional representation rather than FPTP districts; and 6. Senate seats per state being decided in terms of population size, say 1-3 depending on size. Then sure, let's have voter ID. [1]: https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/republicans-voter-fraud-convictions-2024-rcna146434 https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/republicans-vote... [2]: https://www.al.com/news/montgomery/2016/12/feds_alabama_to_expand_drivers.html https://www.al.com/news/montgomery/2016/12/feds_alabama_to_e... [3]: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10624504/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10624504/ [4]: https://www.insidehighered.com/news/students/free-speech/2023/07/07/bans-student-ids-voting-proposed-five-states https://www.insidehighered.com/news/students/free-speech/202...

epoxia 2y ago
We can have voter ID once we get a proper national ID to replaces Social insecurity numbers.
- hindsightbias 2y ago
  That would lead to the “mark of the beast” and anti-govt crowd never voting again, which would be fine, but hypocritical for any voting advocate.
  - nozzlegear 2y ago
    I'm only vaguely familiar with the "mark of the beast" stuff from my catechism days as a kid. Isn't it supposed to be a tattoo or physical mark on the body? How would the proposed national ID differ from the social security number we already receive?
    - MisterBastahrd 2y ago
      It's whatever these luddites dream up in their intelligence-stricken skulls. It also changes depending on the day of the week and the direction of the wind. For example, our current credit system is much closer to "mark of the beast" level stuff than a society where everything is paid for with physical cash, but the same people who are afraid of the mark are fine with credit cards because it keeps undesirables away from them. The truly destitute are not going to have a credit card most of the time, and if they do it's because they're cashing checks through a payday lender who keeps 3% of their income plus a service fee in order to keep their account.
- jimbob45 2y ago
  Elections are state-run. You shouldn’t need a national ID to vote in a state-run election. You should only need a state-issued ID. The best thing to come out of Bush v Gore was the reinforcement of elections being state-run.
jimbob45 2y ago

cyanydeez 2y ago

As soon as you make both voting and getting id free and paid timeoff or holiday, great. But thats never how voter id laws in america aee proposed, and as such, they are the same as antivoter laws.

ImJamal 2y ago
As far as I can tell, every state that has voter id also provides free IDs. They don't have PTO or holidays though.
- blululu 2y ago
  Can't speak to the other 49 states, but California does have a legal requirement for taking time off to vote on Election Day. We also have polling stations that are open in the days before the election so I was able to simply vote on a Saturday morning in the last election which feels like a solid policy.
  - WaitWaitWha 2y ago
    California also has a requirement that ID for any traffic violation, including non-vehicular ones must be shown. Which makes ID ownership and carrying one at all the time a de facto requirement in CA. With the REAL ID Act of 2005, most of the State ID cards (not just driver's licenses) are REAL ID-compliant, meaning they can be used for any state and Federal identification. Some fees: New York: $9.00 - $13.00 (varies based on age and duration of the card). For individuals under 62, the standard fee is $13.00 for an 8-year ID. Those 62 or older with Supplemental Security Income (SSI) can get it for $6.50. Texas: $16.00. The ID card is valid for six years. Reduced fees are available for individuals aged 60 or older and those who are disables. Florida: $25.00. This is the standard fee for a Florida ID card. The card is valid for eight years. The state offers free ID cards to individuals who are homeless or are 100% disabled vets California: $38.00. The fee for a regular ID card in California is $38.00. However, the state offers free ID cards to low-income individuals, seniors, and those who are homeless under specific programs
    - 2y ago

choward 2y ago

Mail out ballots then require an ID when you turn it in. Make it easier to get an ID if that's a problem. It seems pretty simple to me. Not sure why anyone would be against this.

jeffbee 2y ago
We're against it because allowing ten thousand unelected petty bureaucrats to adjudicate whether a voter is or is not allowed to cast their ballot on election day isn't a good system.
- weaksauce 2y ago
  to anyone wondering what this looks like in practice... google "hanging chad"
sandworm101 2y ago
> Not sure why anyone would be against this. Because of all the edge cases. Some people do not have ID. Some have ID but it doesn't match their current address. Some people have ID but the same name+address as a dead person (not uncommon when people inherit houses from dead parents). Most people would be fine with ID requirements if they could trust that these edge cases will not be leveraged by some local volunteer with an agenda. In the never-ending 50-50 split of US politics, edge cases are too often the decider. See Florida 2000, where those who couldn't properly punch a hole in a piece of paper ended up deciding the presidency.
philipov 2y ago
> Make it easier to get an ID if that's a problem. ... Not sure why anyone would be against this. Because the same people trying to make IDs required also want them to be harder to get, not easier.
- mminer237 2y ago
  I have never heard of anyone pushing to make IDs harder to get.