5 ms·
France is arresting people for providing end-to-end encrypted communications? What could possibly go wrong!
by pjkundert 2y ago
France is arresting people for providing end-to-end encrypted communications?
What could possibly go wrong!
- Krasnol 2y agoTelegram doesn't have much to do with E2EE.
- BadHumans 2y ago> French authorities believe that Telegram, under Durov’s leadership, became a major platform for organised crime due to its encrypted messaging services, which allegedly facilitated illegal activities Sounds like it was because of E2EE.
- drmaximus 2y agoEncrypted doesn't necessarily mean e2ee.
- CuriousCosmic 2y agoNope. It's because of the large telegram group chats for the most part and those aren't E2EE. The only chats that can be E2EE on telegram are one to one DMs and that's only if you manually enable it. i.e. They refused to turn over chat records that they have server side access to. It's worth noting that they could do E2EE here for group chats but they don't. Signal does it but telegram wholesale refused to.
- Hikikomori 2y agoIt doesn't do E2EE by default, you need to select it when messaging someone.
- Aspos 2y agoCan you, please, elaborate? Wasn't it their main feature and the selling point?
- tail_exchange 2y agoE2EE is optional. Telegram does have it, but you don't need to use it.
- jsheard 2y agoTelegram also only supports E2EE in one-to-one chats, so any bad guys operating out of group chats / channels are definitely doing so in the clear.
- financetechbro 2y agoWhat are the downsides to telegram providing default E2EE? Seems like a no brainer to have it as a default feature for the product.
- robjan 2y agoTheir focus is on UX more than security. The app is super snappy and supports group chats with hundreds of thousands of participants.
- jsheard 2y agoI think they don't support cross-device syncing or automatic backups of E2EE chats, so it's about minimising friction by default. Telegrams main focus is UX, unlike Signal which prioritizes security at the expense of UX.
- maqp 2y agoThere's nothing in Telegram that couldn't be implemented with security in mind. They just lack the expertise in designing cryptographic protocols that offer those features, and Durov is too proud to consult experts in helping improve the design. Well, now he gets to enjoy French hospitality.
- maqp 2y agoIt doesn't. Groups chats lack E2EE and all desktop chats, including 1:1 lack E2EE.
- danielovichdk 2y agoI don't why you were downvoted. Because that is exactly what is going on. EU is generally on a open-encryption-by-warrant path and this is a great example of applying some pressuring. Should we enable the Iranian polotical refugee to communicate in secret with her family ? Should we by warrant enable the possibility to open up messages when pedofiles sell or buy children for sex ? Nasty questions.
- jimbob45 2y agoAren’t you advocating for a Big Brother-style system?
- danielovichdk 2y agoNot at all. I wish the iranian political refugee can communicate with her family without the state to intervene. That's great. But at the same time I wish a court order can open up encryption when it's needed. But the balance is difficult. As we see all the time.
- 0xEF 2y agoMany will disagree with you because your stance does not take an all-or-nothing approach, so good on you for asking these tougher questions. We have the same sort of questions in the US, though a very specific group would love to turn this who country into a police state (they even have their own flag). I am a big privacy advocate, but also recognize that it is ripe for abuse by bad actors, so the solutions are muddy and need some serious beta testing before they can be called solutions. This where people tend to get lost in the debate and start responding with emotions rather than reason, which unfortunately does not progress us a viable solution. I see the same thing happening in the EU, but from afar, so my perception is likely skewed.