4 ms·

> But... don't the control panel windows have more functionality (and usability) in practice? Yes, and they're not alone even in the FOSS world (cough ...Gnome

> But... don't the control panel windows have more functionality (and usability) in practice? Yes, and they're not alone even in the FOSS world (cough ...Gnome... cough). My take on this is that someone decided that everything must either run on a cellphone or conform to its UI, therefore GUIs are slowly moving to the mobile touch screen model, which translates into leaving lots of unused space because of the bigger size of finger tips compared to mouse pointers that could trigger errors with smaller and more dense controls, and of course less controls because smaller screens with comparable resolution to much larger monitors would make them much harder to operate. I can understand the reason, however all comes from the 1st mistake which is the attempt to unify everything to a mobile UI, probably to save on development time. It's unnecessary and it's wrong.

exe34 2y ago
> save on development time thank you, I needed a good belly laugh! Windows 95 was built in 3 years and its user interface is still superior to anything they've come up since then - instant redraws, buttons respond to clicks, information was laid out as needed, not to look good in a theoretical sense, etc.
- cyberax 2y ago
  IMO, the apex of Windows was WinXP.
  - flohofwoe 2y ago
    WinXP was just a reskinned Windows 2000... which was the actual apex of Windows UIs ;P
- skydhash 2y ago
  Windows XP and Windows 7, although with a lack of consistency (compared to macOS) was great for getting things done and powerfull on even low hardware (I liked how it disable areo effects if you did not have the GPU for it).
- mkl 2y ago
  I remember it very differently. You could often watch interfaces be drawn line-by-line and box-by-box, with many pixels getting redrawn multiple times before it was finished. Buttons responded to clicks, as long as you waited. The information layout was good though. I would say your comment makes more sense for Windows 2000.
  - _ZeD_ 2y ago
    what were you using as pc? a moka pot? windows '98 - even on a semi decent machine - was fast
    - mkl 2y ago
      Windows 98 was quite a step up in polish and performance from Windows 95, even on the same hardware. Windows 2000 was an even bigger step up in polish, but more resource hungry.
    - Maken 2y ago
      Exactly, Windows 98. Windows 95 was like the beta version, where all the functionality was there but did not work most of the time.
    - keyringlight 2y ago
      Remember that was the era of single processor PCs, if you had a really demanding CPU hog you generally had to forget about trying to multitask as the experience would be painful. If you had something like file compression happening (which could also occupy the HDD) it'd leave little for the UI redrawing, and this is also long before that aspect was accelerated
      - exe34 2y ago
        right, but you can also bring a modern system to its knees with a high enough load. the new systems suck by default. keyboard response time is much higher than ever because of the accumulation of abstraction strata.
  - Narishma 2y ago
binkHN 2y ago
This is a major part of why I switched to Linux! Microsoft is literally killing the desktop by turning Windows into a tablet OS! There are still many great DEs on Linux that are actually DEs!
- mewpmewp2 2y ago
  The only reason I use Windows is the gamezz. Work is macbook, but I hate macOS settings and everything as well. Can't easily configure mouse acceleration or disable it is crazy to me. On personal I use WSL for dev, but maybe I should just dualboot Linux.
  - urxvtcd 2y ago
    You can disable it: https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/460992/how-can-i-really-turn-off-mouse-cursor-acceleration-in-macos-14-0-sonoma https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/460992/how-can-i-r...
    - mewpmewp2 2y ago
      Yes, this is the method that I have been always using. But I have had many cases where it seems to reset or bug out in some other way, and the Logitech MX Master 3S does still does not work well. There's definitely something weird about movement, it doesn't feel linear and accurate even after running this command. The mouse feels perfect on Windows/Linux, but it's off in my Macbook. Sometimes also loses bluetooth connectivity, where it kind of starts to skip and/or stops working completely. And I have to take the bluetooth usb, put it back in for it to work normally again. Maybe I should try another mouse, if you have any recommendations for a similar, ergonomic wireless one. Definitely don't want the magic mouse. Ergonomically I think the Logitech one is perfect for me.
      - urxvtcd 2y ago
        I do own a device I'm very fond of, Ploopy Mouse, but it's not likely to match your criteria. It's quite big, 3D-printed, open source, wired, and runs QMK. Loads of character :) https://ploopy.co/mouse/ https://ploopy.co/mouse/
card_zero 2y ago
But why? Windows phone died. What's going to run these phone-apps-for-Windows-desktop, other than Windows desktop, where they have the ergonomics of a rubber unicycle?
- hulitu 2y ago
  > Windows phone died. But the mindset lives on.
- namdnay 2y ago
  Maybe those windows laptops with touchscreens?
  - axitanull 2y ago
    I wonder how much % of windows are Surface tablets, that they think going with this decision is wise.
OvbiousError 2y ago
The settings panel of kde plasma on the hand is bonkers good.

exe34 2y ago

> save on development time thank you, I needed a good belly laugh! Windows 95 was built in 3 years and its user interface is still superior to anything they've come up since then - instant redraws, buttons respond to clicks, information was laid out as needed, not to look good in a theoretical sense, etc.

cyberax 2y ago
IMO, the apex of Windows was WinXP.
- flohofwoe 2y ago
  WinXP was just a reskinned Windows 2000... which was the actual apex of Windows UIs ;P
skydhash 2y ago
Windows XP and Windows 7, although with a lack of consistency (compared to macOS) was great for getting things done and powerfull on even low hardware (I liked how it disable areo effects if you did not have the GPU for it).
mkl 2y ago
I remember it very differently. You could often watch interfaces be drawn line-by-line and box-by-box, with many pixels getting redrawn multiple times before it was finished. Buttons responded to clicks, as long as you waited. The information layout was good though. I would say your comment makes more sense for Windows 2000.
- _ZeD_ 2y ago
  what were you using as pc? a moka pot? windows '98 - even on a semi decent machine - was fast
  - mkl 2y ago
    Windows 98 was quite a step up in polish and performance from Windows 95, even on the same hardware. Windows 2000 was an even bigger step up in polish, but more resource hungry.
  - Maken 2y ago
    Exactly, Windows 98. Windows 95 was like the beta version, where all the functionality was there but did not work most of the time.
  - keyringlight 2y ago
    Remember that was the era of single processor PCs, if you had a really demanding CPU hog you generally had to forget about trying to multitask as the experience would be painful. If you had something like file compression happening (which could also occupy the HDD) it'd leave little for the UI redrawing, and this is also long before that aspect was accelerated
    - exe34 2y ago
      right, but you can also bring a modern system to its knees with a high enough load. the new systems suck by default. keyboard response time is much higher than ever because of the accumulation of abstraction strata.
- Narishma 2y ago

binkHN 2y ago

This is a major part of why I switched to Linux! Microsoft is literally killing the desktop by turning Windows into a tablet OS! There are still many great DEs on Linux that are actually DEs!

mewpmewp2 2y ago
The only reason I use Windows is the gamezz. Work is macbook, but I hate macOS settings and everything as well. Can't easily configure mouse acceleration or disable it is crazy to me. On personal I use WSL for dev, but maybe I should just dualboot Linux.
- urxvtcd 2y ago
  You can disable it: https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/460992/how-can-i-really-turn-off-mouse-cursor-acceleration-in-macos-14-0-sonoma https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/460992/how-can-i-r...
  - mewpmewp2 2y ago
    Yes, this is the method that I have been always using. But I have had many cases where it seems to reset or bug out in some other way, and the Logitech MX Master 3S does still does not work well. There's definitely something weird about movement, it doesn't feel linear and accurate even after running this command. The mouse feels perfect on Windows/Linux, but it's off in my Macbook. Sometimes also loses bluetooth connectivity, where it kind of starts to skip and/or stops working completely. And I have to take the bluetooth usb, put it back in for it to work normally again. Maybe I should try another mouse, if you have any recommendations for a similar, ergonomic wireless one. Definitely don't want the magic mouse. Ergonomically I think the Logitech one is perfect for me.
    - urxvtcd 2y ago
      I do own a device I'm very fond of, Ploopy Mouse, but it's not likely to match your criteria. It's quite big, 3D-printed, open source, wired, and runs QMK. Loads of character :) https://ploopy.co/mouse/ https://ploopy.co/mouse/

card_zero 2y ago

But why? Windows phone died. What's going to run these phone-apps-for-Windows-desktop, other than Windows desktop, where they have the ergonomics of a rubber unicycle?

hulitu 2y ago
> Windows phone died. But the mindset lives on.
namdnay 2y ago
Maybe those windows laptops with touchscreens?
- axitanull 2y ago
  I wonder how much % of windows are Surface tablets, that they think going with this decision is wise.

OvbiousError 2y ago

The settings panel of kde plasma on the hand is bonkers good.