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I can respect the arguments for making it public but there are strong arguments also to raise a high barrier of entry to discourage abuse. Further, the fewer us

I can respect the arguments for making it public but there are strong arguments also to raise a high barrier of entry to discourage abuse. Further, the fewer users of the list, they easier they are to police.

xnorswap 2y ago
It's a lookup between postcode and address, what is the abuse cases you're worried about?
- lnxg33k1 2y ago
  Considering that in UK if you live in a building, the door next to you can have a different postcode, I wouldn't worry at all
  - xnorswap 2y ago
    If that weren't true, you'd have entire cities in the same postcode. There has to be a boundary somewhere.
    - nly 2y ago
      Odd numbered homes on one side of the street and evens on the other often have different postcodes
      - willvarfar 2y ago
        Postcodes are about sorting mail to match the delivery rounds.
      - ooklala 2y ago
        Many buildings also have their own postcode! (The second half of the postcode represents the 'delivery point' which is basically limited by the amount of post that the postman/woman can physically carry...)
    - lnxg33k1 2y ago
      Well, in Italy postcodes define city areas, and cities, for example for my city the main postcode is 80100, but my area is 80142, and it contains few buildings, so it's different from UK, UK was the first time I saw such specific postcodes, and I've lived also in Germany and Netherlands
      - Muromec 2y ago
        Netherlands had a postcode per street
        lnxg33k1 2y ago
        Oh yeah, I remember being able to insert just postcode and street number in forms, but it's not as specific as UK, I think
  - ben_w 2y ago
    I've lived in a one bed apartment where the front and back doors had different postcodes. IIRC, the neighbours to one side in the same building had a third postcode for their front, but shared mine for the back.
- pjc50 2y ago
  Crucially, it doesn't have people's names in it.
  - xnorswap 2y ago
    Indeed. If it's an issue that someone would know your address, then it's an issue that they would know your postcode. If it's an issue that someone would know your postcode, then it's an issue that they would know your address. I'm struggling to think of a scenario where you'd be fine with someone knowing one of those pieces of information without knowing the other. It's not therefore an issue that there's a lookup between the two. Indeed you can do it trivially with google maps, or the plenty of other services that expose this database through their operation. Any safety concerns aren't at the layer of translation between postcode and address, they're how someone tied either of those pieces of information to a given person.
secretsatan 2y ago
You miss the point that it was once freely accessible, and now it is not.
- scraplab 2y ago
  I don’t believe it’s ever been accessible for free. It’s just that ownership has moved from the state to a private company and now it’s difficult to make it open.
nottorp 2y ago
Yeah, maybe you should pay a subscription to know your own post code...
IneffablePigeon 2y ago
What nonsense. Are you worried about physical spam mail? That ship has already sailed. I genuinely can’t think of any other abuse vector for a dataset like this.
andrewjl 2y ago
> Would open address data create privacy risks? No. Unlike opening up more sensitive datasets such as personal location, releasing address data - a list of the physical places recognised by the government - carries few new legal or ethical risks. Many other countries are doing this, including those with strong privacy regimes. Open address data could only create new risks if it were linked and used with other datasets, and these risks should be managed in that context. The harms created by the lack of access to address data are more pressing. https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5ee7a7d964aeed7e5c507900/t/655dd5d4d1c0f4729bca69c9/1700648428211/Briefing%3A+Address+data https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5ee7a7d964aeed7e5c507...
mrweasel 2y ago
How exactly would that be abused? Denmark have a website where you can enter any address, or an address close to where you want to be and then let you select the right house on a map. The same site will show you the owners, the purchase price the taxable value, size, number of bathrooms, stuff like that. I used it to find the address of a friend when I needed to ship him a present and I only roughly knew where he lives.

xnorswap 2y ago

It's a lookup between postcode and address, what is the abuse cases you're worried about?

lnxg33k1 2y ago
Considering that in UK if you live in a building, the door next to you can have a different postcode, I wouldn't worry at all
- xnorswap 2y ago
  If that weren't true, you'd have entire cities in the same postcode. There has to be a boundary somewhere.
  - nly 2y ago
    Odd numbered homes on one side of the street and evens on the other often have different postcodes
    - willvarfar 2y ago
      Postcodes are about sorting mail to match the delivery rounds.
    - ooklala 2y ago
      Many buildings also have their own postcode! (The second half of the postcode represents the 'delivery point' which is basically limited by the amount of post that the postman/woman can physically carry...)
  - lnxg33k1 2y ago
    Well, in Italy postcodes define city areas, and cities, for example for my city the main postcode is 80100, but my area is 80142, and it contains few buildings, so it's different from UK, UK was the first time I saw such specific postcodes, and I've lived also in Germany and Netherlands
    - Muromec 2y ago
      Netherlands had a postcode per street
      - lnxg33k1 2y ago
        Oh yeah, I remember being able to insert just postcode and street number in forms, but it's not as specific as UK, I think
- ben_w 2y ago
  I've lived in a one bed apartment where the front and back doors had different postcodes. IIRC, the neighbours to one side in the same building had a third postcode for their front, but shared mine for the back.
pjc50 2y ago
Crucially, it doesn't have people's names in it.
- xnorswap 2y ago
  Indeed. If it's an issue that someone would know your address, then it's an issue that they would know your postcode. If it's an issue that someone would know your postcode, then it's an issue that they would know your address. I'm struggling to think of a scenario where you'd be fine with someone knowing one of those pieces of information without knowing the other. It's not therefore an issue that there's a lookup between the two. Indeed you can do it trivially with google maps, or the plenty of other services that expose this database through their operation. Any safety concerns aren't at the layer of translation between postcode and address, they're how someone tied either of those pieces of information to a given person.

secretsatan 2y ago

You miss the point that it was once freely accessible, and now it is not.

scraplab 2y ago
I don’t believe it’s ever been accessible for free. It’s just that ownership has moved from the state to a private company and now it’s difficult to make it open.

nottorp 2y ago

Yeah, maybe you should pay a subscription to know your own post code...

IneffablePigeon 2y ago

What nonsense. Are you worried about physical spam mail? That ship has already sailed. I genuinely can’t think of any other abuse vector for a dataset like this.

andrewjl 2y ago

> Would open address data create privacy risks? No. Unlike opening up more sensitive datasets such as personal location, releasing address data - a list of the physical places recognised by the government - carries few new legal or ethical risks. Many other countries are doing this, including those with strong privacy regimes. Open address data could only create new risks if it were linked and used with other datasets, and these risks should be managed in that context. The harms created by the lack of access to address data are more pressing. https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5ee7a7d964aeed7e5c507900/t/655dd5d4d1c0f4729bca69c9/1700648428211/Briefing%3A+Address+data https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5ee7a7d964aeed7e5c507...

mrweasel 2y ago

How exactly would that be abused? Denmark have a website where you can enter any address, or an address close to where you want to be and then let you select the right house on a map. The same site will show you the owners, the purchase price the taxable value, size, number of bathrooms, stuff like that. I used it to find the address of a friend when I needed to ship him a present and I only roughly knew where he lives.