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Leaked Microsoft pay data shows how much software engineers report making
- Someone1234 2y agoAnyone able to contextualize what "Level 59" means here? Also is that $126K base workable in the Seattle, Washington market?
- captainkrtek 2y ago$126k base is certainly livable in the Seattle area, though may be difficult to get ahead (ie: save for a house). Pretty comparable to entry level Amazon SDE 1 pay (at least years ago)
- OJFord 2y agoJunior/mid https://www.levels.fyi/?compare=Microsoft&track=Software%20Engineer https://www.levels.fyi/?compare=Microsoft&track=Software%20E... (The level number starting so high is I'd guess due to an homogenous pay structure, so some non-engineering, junior HR say, roles lower paid (<L59) than where engineering happens to start.)
- skt5 2y ago59/60 - SDE 61/62 - SDE II 63/64 - Senior SDE 65/66/67 - Principle SDE (aka Staff) 68/69 - Partner SDE (aka Senior Staff)
- delusional 2y agoI think 59 is entry level engineering.
- metajack 2y agoLevel 59 is the entry level software engineer position. Similar to E3 at Meta or L3 at Google. Levels.fyi does a pretty good job at this kind of context at least for the big companies.
- paxys 2y ago59 is the level that new college hires and entry-level engineers start at.
- runamuck 2y agoOh wow! I got $37k in 1999 (~$69k 2024 according to BLS) in the DC area, for a Software Engineering job. I love to hear that grads now get rewarded w/ $125k fresh out.
- ylee 2y agoMy Goldman Sachs starting salary as a new analyst out of college in 1999 was US$40K. During that first year, because of the dotcom bubble, Goldman raised the salary to $55/65/75K for first/second/third-year analysts, and my end-of-year bonus in 2000 was close to 100% of salary. Then the full effect of the recession/market crash hit and the 2001 bonus was, well, much smaller.
- runamuck 2y agoWow that's huge in 2024 dollars!
- lesuorac 2y agoMicrosoft in the DC area or somebody else like Raytheon? I would expect Raytheon and the other contractors (i.e. Booze Alan) have raised entry level to like 70/80k but they're going to be much lower than Microsoft. As well as as you get promoted it caps out much lower. It's a bit better at non-contractors like Capitol One but still not quite the same as a "Tech Company". https://www.levels.fyi/?compare=Raytheon,Microsoft,Capital%20One,Booz%20Allen%20Hamilton&track=Software%20Engineer https://www.levels.fyi/?compare=Raytheon,Microsoft,Capital%2...
- runamuck 2y agoA Raytheon like company.
- dartharva 2y agoHuh, I thought engineers' pay scale would be a lot higher than program managers, business analysts, administrators, consultants and the like. It isn't. At all.
- clark_dent 2y agoWhy in the name of all that is unholy would you ever think that? The people in charge of pay and hiring will never, ever, ever set things up such that they're considered less important or are paid less.
- petesergeant 2y ago> The people in charge of pay and hiring will never, ever, ever set things up such that they're considered less important or are paid less. HR and accounting get paid less than engineers in every country on earth
- almostgotcaught 2y agoHR and accounting don't hire and pay you, they're just the ones that fill out the paperwork. Isn't this obvious.
- tennisflyi 2y agoThose are the boots on the ground. The people in charge are those they listed, i.e, program managers, business analysts, administrators, consultants...
- bluGill 2y agoHR and accounting are not in charge of pay and hiring. They are involved, but management is in charge and sets the rules. I have seen cases where I made more than my boss (the difference was a few hundred/year), but it wasn't long before they promoted my boss so that wasn't the case. (I'm convinced that it was only allowed to happen just long enough to say it was possible and then when nobody was looking they promoted him to ensure it doesn't become a pattern)
- the_arun 2y agoBlocked by Paywall. Here is another copy - https://www.entrepreneur.com/business-news/leaked-data-shows-microsoft-salary-guidelines-for-job-offers/463892 https://www.entrepreneur.com/business-news/leaked-data-shows...
- welder 2y agohttps://archive.is/ao37O https://archive.is/ao37O
- vr46 2y agocries in European monies
- pjmlp 2y agoBetween 22 and 30 days paid vacation, healthcare, guaranteed payment on layoffs, free time outside official hour works, 35 to 40 hours work week, paid leaves due to illness, childcare, unions,....
- IncreasePosts 2y agoAll those things are given to a Microsoft software engineer. It's really only the low paying jobs that there's a directly benefit from the European model.
- ngruhn 2y agoEven guaranteed payment on layoff?
- Jtsummers 2y agoUnemployment insurance is mostly guaranteed if you lost the job through no fault of your own (weren't fired, didn't quit), but the amount varies by state. Good luck with receiving it in a timely manner. Took months for my wife to receive it when she was let go in 2023. If we'd been counting on her income we would have been homeless by the time the first payment came in.
- IncreasePosts 2y agoIt's not guaranteed, but these big tech companies always give severance with layoffs. At Microsoft I believe it was 1 month pay + 1 week pay per 6 months employed. And that's not including any extra downtime where you're not working but technically employed(maybe, due to 60 day notice required by WARN act, for example)
- pjmlp 2y agoUntil they aren't and there is no US law to give them back.
- tennisflyi 2y agoYou don't even need a leak - just levels.fyi.
- jppope 2y agoSeems a little low compared to the numbers I've seen reported, which makes sense. The promoted numbers are actually the most shocking, they must lose a lot of people
- xyst 2y agoDoesn’t mention the distribution of employees though. Is the AI/Azure division mostly located in Redmond? If so, the pay scale is very low. The more these companies consolidate. The less competition there is. Thus can get away with terrible pay. I don’t know why anybody would work at the second layer of hell known as Microsoft. Third layer of hell is probably Dell or Oracle.
- oldpersonintx 2y ago[dead]
- Mistletoe 2y agoI think your layers of hell are very skewed by recent human history and may need a bit of a healthy reality check. In almost all of human existence, working at Microsoft or Oracle and sitting in a cushy chair coding and being paid ungodly amounts of money would be considered eternal paradise. “You are your ancestors’ wildest dreams.”
- wiseowise 2y ago[flagged]
- mecsred 2y agoSure, your standards are what you set them as. Settle for what you think is appropriate. It does mean you should whine less though.
- JonChesterfield 2y agoI'm not sure it's the coding we get paid for. It's tolerating everything else around it.
- salawat 2y agoYou're being paid to build the mechanisms of power projection, and to completely divest yourself from the question of how the fruits of your labor are then applied.
- Xeamek 2y ago'Promotions' table is incorrect, right? It's inverted...
- neilv 2y agohttps://www.levels.fyi/?compare=Microsoft,Google,Facebook&track=Software%20Engineer https://www.levels.fyi/?compare=Microsoft,Google,Facebook&tr...