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This means that people without means will automatically be excluded from the internet. Also most people don't want to pay for content. This just means that 99

This means that people without means will automatically be excluded from the internet. Also most people don't want to pay for content. This just means that 99.99% of the web will instantly disappear.

pessimizer 2y ago
> This means that people without means will automatically be excluded from the internet. No, they'll be relegated to the charitable internet, the advocacy internet, the nerdy obsessive internet, the public science internet, the FOSS internet, the public domain internet, and the piracy internet. And whenever any of these groups come up with a project they want to do, they won't have to ramp it up to billion dollar scale in order not to be drowned out by a terrible and loud commercial product. There will be plenty of broke users looking for alternatives. > This just means that 99.99% of the web will instantly disappear. I think the only risk of this happening is if free alternatives get so generous and useful that the commercial internet tries to raise the price of bandwidth somehow, or of running a server in general, or alternatively by lobbying for expensive regulatory stuff to get governments to do their dirty work for them. The US seems like it's on the verge of state licensing of speech and journalism, and that sentiment is easily moved to any sort of internet hosting of any service.
- LunaSea 2y ago
  > And whenever any of these groups come up with a project they want to do, they won't have to ramp it up to billion dollar scale in order not to be drowned out by a terrible and loud commercial product. There will be plenty of broke users looking for alternatives. They absolutely will have to since they won't have the means to serve the content to the community otherwise. Niche websites won't stay niche for very long if they are the only free option. > I think the only risk of this happening is if free alternatives get so generous and useful that the commercial internet tries to raise the price of bandwidth somehow, or of running a server in general, or alternatively by lobbying for expensive regulatory stuff to get governments to do their dirty work for them. I don't see most of these free alternatives even existing in the first place. For example: free news reporting (not even talking about foreign correspondents & co).
- bugtodiffer 2y ago
  > the commercial internet tries to raise the price of bandwidth somehow This is already happening. They wanted to make us pay more because we are using netflix and other streaming services so much. Everything important like internet and streets should be built and maintained by the gov and not some random companies, f*ck Telekom.
  - kjkjadksj 2y ago
    The issue is our government doesn’t function anything like that. We don’t build roads. We write checks to for profit contractors to build our roads. What would government internet look like? A massive check to meta and more or less the same environment we have today.
Dalewyn 2y ago
Going back to 90s internet is a very good thing.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- LunaSea 2y ago
  Which site from the 90s are you still visiting regularly in it's 90s form?
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - Dalewyn 2y ago
    /.
    - LunaSea 2y ago
      The same Slashdot that is monetised through advertisement with 500M monthly ad impressions? Source: https://slashdotmedia.com/advertising-and-marketing-services/display-advertising/#sdm-by-the-numbers https://slashdotmedia.com/advertising-and-marketing-services...
      - Dalewyn 2y ago
        I mean, they still don't/can't handle Unicode.
  - layer8 2y ago
    Personal blogs. Smaller online retailers. Not a web site, but Usenet and mailing lists.
blueflow 2y ago
> This just means that 99.99% of the web will instantly disappear. 99.99% of your web.
- LunaSea 2y ago
  99.99% of the web, full stop.
  - blueflow 2y ago
    What about HN? What about make-firefox-private-again.com? Go through the HN frontpage and the links. Thats why i'm sure you are wrong.
    - LunaSea 2y ago
      > What about HN? The same HN that is heavily moderated by a paid employee and paid for by a multi-billion dollars net worth company called YCombinator?
      - lolinder 2y ago
        Y Combinator will continue to exist in a post-attention-economy world. They have proven themselves to be quite adaptable.
        LunaSea 2y ago
        > Y Combinator will continue to exist in a post-attention-economy world. They have proven themselves to be quite adaptable. That's not the question. Hacker News was used as an example of an old-school site that worked without monetisation. Which is clearly not the case.
        cml123 2y ago
        Surely HN doesn't require the existence of YC as a startup accelerator to exist, right? HN has to me survived because of its community and shared values wrt discussion. The moderation probably plays a role in it, but that's also easily decoupled from big money.
lelanthran 2y ago
> This just means that 99.99% of the web will instantly disappear. Fine by me. I'll browse the remaining 0.01%, search engines will be useful again and people won't be doom-scrolling all the time to see morons eating.

This means that people without means will automatically be excluded from the internet. Also most people don't want to pay for content. This just means that 99.99% of the web will instantly disappear.

pessimizer 2y ago

> This means that people without means will automatically be excluded from the internet. No, they'll be relegated to the charitable internet, the advocacy internet, the nerdy obsessive internet, the public science internet, the FOSS internet, the public domain internet, and the piracy internet. And whenever any of these groups come up with a project they want to do, they won't have to ramp it up to billion dollar scale in order not to be drowned out by a terrible and loud commercial product. There will be plenty of broke users looking for alternatives. > This just means that 99.99% of the web will instantly disappear. I think the only risk of this happening is if free alternatives get so generous and useful that the commercial internet tries to raise the price of bandwidth somehow, or of running a server in general, or alternatively by lobbying for expensive regulatory stuff to get governments to do their dirty work for them. The US seems like it's on the verge of state licensing of speech and journalism, and that sentiment is easily moved to any sort of internet hosting of any service.

LunaSea 2y ago
> And whenever any of these groups come up with a project they want to do, they won't have to ramp it up to billion dollar scale in order not to be drowned out by a terrible and loud commercial product. There will be plenty of broke users looking for alternatives. They absolutely will have to since they won't have the means to serve the content to the community otherwise. Niche websites won't stay niche for very long if they are the only free option. > I think the only risk of this happening is if free alternatives get so generous and useful that the commercial internet tries to raise the price of bandwidth somehow, or of running a server in general, or alternatively by lobbying for expensive regulatory stuff to get governments to do their dirty work for them. I don't see most of these free alternatives even existing in the first place. For example: free news reporting (not even talking about foreign correspondents & co).
bugtodiffer 2y ago
> the commercial internet tries to raise the price of bandwidth somehow This is already happening. They wanted to make us pay more because we are using netflix and other streaming services so much. Everything important like internet and streets should be built and maintained by the gov and not some random companies, f*ck Telekom.
- kjkjadksj 2y ago
  The issue is our government doesn’t function anything like that. We don’t build roads. We write checks to for profit contractors to build our roads. What would government internet look like? A massive check to meta and more or less the same environment we have today.

Dalewyn 2y ago

Going back to 90s internet is a very good thing.

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
LunaSea 2y ago
Which site from the 90s are you still visiting regularly in it's 90s form?
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- Dalewyn 2y ago
  /.
  - LunaSea 2y ago
    The same Slashdot that is monetised through advertisement with 500M monthly ad impressions? Source: https://slashdotmedia.com/advertising-and-marketing-services/display-advertising/#sdm-by-the-numbers https://slashdotmedia.com/advertising-and-marketing-services...
    - Dalewyn 2y ago
      I mean, they still don't/can't handle Unicode.
- layer8 2y ago
  Personal blogs. Smaller online retailers. Not a web site, but Usenet and mailing lists.

blueflow 2y ago

> This just means that 99.99% of the web will instantly disappear. 99.99% of your web.

LunaSea 2y ago
99.99% of the web, full stop.
- blueflow 2y ago
  What about HN? What about make-firefox-private-again.com? Go through the HN frontpage and the links. Thats why i'm sure you are wrong.
  - LunaSea 2y ago
    > What about HN? The same HN that is heavily moderated by a paid employee and paid for by a multi-billion dollars net worth company called YCombinator?
    - lolinder 2y ago
      Y Combinator will continue to exist in a post-attention-economy world. They have proven themselves to be quite adaptable.
      - LunaSea 2y ago
        > Y Combinator will continue to exist in a post-attention-economy world. They have proven themselves to be quite adaptable. That's not the question. Hacker News was used as an example of an old-school site that worked without monetisation. Which is clearly not the case.
        cml123 2y ago
        Surely HN doesn't require the existence of YC as a startup accelerator to exist, right? HN has to me survived because of its community and shared values wrt discussion. The moderation probably plays a role in it, but that's also easily decoupled from big money.

lelanthran 2y ago

> This just means that 99.99% of the web will instantly disappear. Fine by me. I'll browse the remaining 0.01%, search engines will be useful again and people won't be doom-scrolling all the time to see morons eating.