4 ms·

It's pretty obvious where that reaction is coming from. As recently as last year Microsoft was singing the praises of being able to kinda-sorta-use desktop sof

by roc 14y ago

It's pretty obvious where that reaction is coming from. As recently as last year Microsoft was singing the praises of being able to kinda-sorta-use desktop software on a tablet and pushing the notion that things without desktop operating systems were 'consumption' devices, at best. So, yes, their sudden reversal on what people want in a tablet is worth noting and easily justifies the same kind of quips and barbs that people lob at Apple over Jobs' similar reversals [1]. And it's pretty easy to be ahead of the curve on blending mobile and desktop operating systems when Microsoft is the only party who sees a problem to be solved in the first place. [2] Because this entire concept -- that people want both -- comes apart at the seams about a month after you've owned an Apple or Android tablet. [3] Simply: there's no user-facing problem being solved here. People use tablets for what they're great at and desktop PCs for what they're great at. And no-one who's ever put their tablet down to use their laptop is looking at that Microsoft Surface tablet and saying "this will mean I don't have to put the tablet down for these tasks anymore". [4] Microsoft is attempting to solve it's own problem with this blending concept and the degree to which this tablet succeeds, is going to strongly track the degree to which Windows stays out of the Metro experience [5]. [1] "No-one wants a widget." (Smash cut to 18 months later) "Introducing Apple's new iWidget!" [2] That Windows is irrelevant in a growing computing market. [3] And I say that as someone who has been pro-tablet for a decade and only grudgingly gave Apple's "big iPod" approach a chance. [4] At best, the typing-heavy market is saying "I wonder how long it will take someone to make an iPad keyboard case that slick." [5] Metro is a unique, interesting and a refreshing change from Apple's icon grid. And I've heard far more praise for it from the design folks that get written off as Apple fanboys, than I have from the Windows crowd who generally echoed Microsoft's 'consumption' FUD.

glanch 14y ago
I disagree that Surface solves a non-existent problem. I have read a ton of positive reactions to Surface over the past day. Some people really DO want a tablet that can also be a laptop. I can't do any 'serious' work on an iPad. If Surface can be my iPad plus my laptop, that's a game-changer for me.
deleted 14y ago
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overgryphon 14y ago
At home I use a macbook and an ipad. The ipad is a consumption device- it's great for playing a casual game, looking up a recipe, and better than kindle for reading pdf files. It isn't really usable for programming, writing documentation, or any real work (that I do). It doesn't replace my laptop, it just does some things in a more convenient way. Microsoft's Surface looks like (for me) it could replace both the ipad and my macbook. It isn't a consumption device- it runs a full operating system. I could remote in to work from anywhere, attach it to a monitor if I wanted to work at home, and easily carry it around. It provides the convenience of a tablet, while allowing real work to be done. It even comes in pretty colors. Apple wants me to own a phone, a music player, a tablet, and a laptop all to do separate things in separate places. This isn't necessary. This is not a reversal of Microsoft's position- it's the logical next step.
- YeeHaw 14y ago
  I completely agree. I would love to be able to ditch the heavy, bulky laptop for a tablet that fit in my purse and still allow me to do real work.
- mc32 14y ago
  For me this tablet/surface could see significant demand from students going back to school this fall. As you said, it's not loger Air + iPad when you can get one device that can do both. I think it's a pretty good strategy from that standpoint. Additionally, with the Intel version being compatible with desktop apps, this should fit in with the business (corporate) environment. Of course, this is speculation, but I think it has a pretty good chance at being successful.
- joeguilmette 14y ago
  If they pull this off, a Windows Phone and a Surface will replace a $3000 Apple set that someone like my mom would use and love. As a deeply invested Apple user, it is nice to see Msft finally making something I might want to use.
- roc 14y ago
  > "Microsoft's Surface looks like (for me) it could replace both the ipad and my macbook." Things always have a way of looking like what we want them to, before we get a chance to see them. I know how it works; I spent a lot of time waiting, hoping and grumbling about Windows tablets. And what I see here, is an ARM tablet that has a real shot as a tablet - provided the Windows side stays out of the way. And a hand-waved x86 tablet that may or may not be notably improved over last year's Windows tablets. From that, you seem to be hoping the best of the ARM tablet (size/battery/usability) is implicit in the x86 tablet or vice-versa (does the ARM tablet even allow keyboard/mouse style apps from third parties?). And that's precisely what remains to be seen.
kooshball 14y ago
> People use tablets for what they're great at and desktop PCs for what they're great at. And no-one who's ever put their tablet down to use their laptop is looking at that Microsoft Surface tablet and saying "this will mean I don't have to put the tablet down for these tasks anymore". [4] I disagree. I see no reason why my mom wouldn't want a single computer to use on a couch for browsing, and on a desk with mouse/keyboard for chatting or photo editing. This seems like an obvious convergence of 2 specialized devices. There are trade offs of course, but if they can deliver a good experience, I think users would be willing to trade the computing power of a desktop for a single all-in-one device. The next obviously step is to have a phone that can replace all 3, with different docks. And once phone CPU gets powerful enough we will definitely see that.
- roc 14y ago
  Why would your mom need a desktop-side to the OS to do chat or photo editing? Firstly, for anyone not already using at least prosumer photo-editing software, the latest iPad apps are preferred to desktop apps by everyone I've seen use them. So lightroom or photoshop users may not be satisfied, but most people looking to make a few standard adjustments are going to get the job done faster and easier by not putting that tablet down. And for substantial amounts of text entry, sure, the keyboard is great. But you don't need traditional OSX/Windows style keyboard-mouse interfaces to handle a keyboard.
- tehayj 14y ago
  I'm a gadget nerd and power user and having less devices that get the job done is always better. I own a Transformer Prime which comes pretty close to what the Windows Surface will over in terms of experience. In terms of media consumption I do not miss anything with the tablet but I find myself so often getting up from the couch walking over to my desk to get some simple tasks done in software XY because traditional software still beats most apps. Having all those software programs running on my tablet will be so amazing!

by roc 14y ago

glanch 14y ago

I disagree that Surface solves a non-existent problem. I have read a ton of positive reactions to Surface over the past day. Some people really DO want a tablet that can also be a laptop. I can't do any 'serious' work on an iPad. If Surface can be my iPad plus my laptop, that's a game-changer for me.

deleted 14y ago

[deleted]

overgryphon 14y ago

At home I use a macbook and an ipad. The ipad is a consumption device- it's great for playing a casual game, looking up a recipe, and better than kindle for reading pdf files. It isn't really usable for programming, writing documentation, or any real work (that I do). It doesn't replace my laptop, it just does some things in a more convenient way. Microsoft's Surface looks like (for me) it could replace both the ipad and my macbook. It isn't a consumption device- it runs a full operating system. I could remote in to work from anywhere, attach it to a monitor if I wanted to work at home, and easily carry it around. It provides the convenience of a tablet, while allowing real work to be done. It even comes in pretty colors. Apple wants me to own a phone, a music player, a tablet, and a laptop all to do separate things in separate places. This isn't necessary. This is not a reversal of Microsoft's position- it's the logical next step.

YeeHaw 14y ago
I completely agree. I would love to be able to ditch the heavy, bulky laptop for a tablet that fit in my purse and still allow me to do real work.
mc32 14y ago
For me this tablet/surface could see significant demand from students going back to school this fall. As you said, it's not loger Air + iPad when you can get one device that can do both. I think it's a pretty good strategy from that standpoint. Additionally, with the Intel version being compatible with desktop apps, this should fit in with the business (corporate) environment. Of course, this is speculation, but I think it has a pretty good chance at being successful.
joeguilmette 14y ago
If they pull this off, a Windows Phone and a Surface will replace a $3000 Apple set that someone like my mom would use and love. As a deeply invested Apple user, it is nice to see Msft finally making something I might want to use.
roc 14y ago
> "Microsoft's Surface looks like (for me) it could replace both the ipad and my macbook." Things always have a way of looking like what we want them to, before we get a chance to see them. I know how it works; I spent a lot of time waiting, hoping and grumbling about Windows tablets. And what I see here, is an ARM tablet that has a real shot as a tablet - provided the Windows side stays out of the way. And a hand-waved x86 tablet that may or may not be notably improved over last year's Windows tablets. From that, you seem to be hoping the best of the ARM tablet (size/battery/usability) is implicit in the x86 tablet or vice-versa (does the ARM tablet even allow keyboard/mouse style apps from third parties?). And that's precisely what remains to be seen.

kooshball 14y ago

> People use tablets for what they're great at and desktop PCs for what they're great at. And no-one who's ever put their tablet down to use their laptop is looking at that Microsoft Surface tablet and saying "this will mean I don't have to put the tablet down for these tasks anymore". [4] I disagree. I see no reason why my mom wouldn't want a single computer to use on a couch for browsing, and on a desk with mouse/keyboard for chatting or photo editing. This seems like an obvious convergence of 2 specialized devices. There are trade offs of course, but if they can deliver a good experience, I think users would be willing to trade the computing power of a desktop for a single all-in-one device. The next obviously step is to have a phone that can replace all 3, with different docks. And once phone CPU gets powerful enough we will definitely see that.

roc 14y ago
Why would your mom need a desktop-side to the OS to do chat or photo editing? Firstly, for anyone not already using at least prosumer photo-editing software, the latest iPad apps are preferred to desktop apps by everyone I've seen use them. So lightroom or photoshop users may not be satisfied, but most people looking to make a few standard adjustments are going to get the job done faster and easier by not putting that tablet down. And for substantial amounts of text entry, sure, the keyboard is great. But you don't need traditional OSX/Windows style keyboard-mouse interfaces to handle a keyboard.
tehayj 14y ago
I'm a gadget nerd and power user and having less devices that get the job done is always better. I own a Transformer Prime which comes pretty close to what the Windows Surface will over in terms of experience. In terms of media consumption I do not miss anything with the tablet but I find myself so often getting up from the couch walking over to my desk to get some simple tasks done in software XY because traditional software still beats most apps. Having all those software programs running on my tablet will be so amazing!