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Does AI cheating in school matter much? The primary party that loses out from the cheating is the cheater because they will fail to learn what they ought to ha

by nullc 2y ago

Does AI cheating in school matter much? The primary party that loses out from the cheating is the cheater because they will fail to learn what they ought to have learned. But wait, you say, won't they get a degree that they didn't earn? Doesn't matter: Right now anyone can just claim to have any degree they want. Universities will not confirm or deny if a particular party got a degree, citing privacy laws. Lying about degrees is probably widespread, we only hear about the few extremely uncommon cases where its caught and the perpetrator was someone high profile. Even as it is, without/prior-to AI plenty of people manage to actually earn respectable looking degrees that turn out to be utter imbeciles in practice. There are greater abuses of AI we ought to be concerned about.

agiacalone 2y ago
> Does AI cheating in school matter much? The primary party that loses out from the cheating is the cheater because they will fail to learn Sure, I suppose. But the secondary effect is that others with the same Uni degree now have their degree valued less in the eyes of whomever hires the cheater and they fail to do their job right. Or, much worse, the cheater gets someone hurt or killed. Tech can kill people--just ask Boeing (guess who has large hiring events at my Uni!). > Universities will not confirm or deny if a particular party got a degree Hmm. I've had several jobs in the past which, as a contingency of being hired, must show proof of a Uni degree via official transcripts. Mine charges $12 for the privilege of printing out your record on "official paper", stamping it, and mailing it to your presumptive employer (or grad school) on demand.
- nullc 2y ago
  > Or, much worse, the cheater gets someone hurt or killed. Tech can kill people--just ask Boeing (guess who has large hiring events at my Uni!). Do you think cheating was a major factor there? Or has Boeing just been prioritizing things like cost over other considerations? For life critical engineering roles it would be entirely reasonable to test candidates. If an org like Boeing fails to do so, it has to be because they just don't prioritize the candidate's capability. Of course someone could cheat some but otherwise study and still pass the test, but I think those candidates will already be pretty job performance indistinguishable from people who didn't cheat. A degree only means so much at best. > I've had several jobs in the past which, as a contingency of being hired, must show proof of a Uni degree via official transcripts. I'm aware of that practice, though I've never experienced it first hand and you're only the second person who has told me that they've experienced it. In any case, it's easily faked if you're willing to be bold about it, particularly where you've enrolled previously (even briefly) -- get a transcript sent to yourself, make a duplicate that says what you want, send that in. Even if your forgery is not very good it is extremely unlikely to get a careful inspection because faked credentials are not currently recognized to be a widespread problem. In practice this kind of validation is rare, so even if you're unwilling to go the master-forger route you're just limited somewhat in your hiring pool. Somewhat ironically, hiring hoops seem to be more common for lower tier position. If your fake degrees aren't working, fake some more and apply as CEO. :D Even in court I've had difficulty dealing with a party faking their credentials via bare assertion.
  - agiacalone 2y ago
    Interesting, and I don't disagree that it can be faked...but that's a whole other issue. For example sake about one of the jobs: it was for a project management position in a big old tech company with three letters.
gizmo686 2y ago
> Universities will not confirm or deny if a particular party got a degree, citing privacy laws. For a nominal fee, universities will send a copy of your transcript to anyone you ask them to. Every job I have had since graduating has asked me to ask my university to send them a copy.

by nullc 2y ago

agiacalone 2y ago

> Does AI cheating in school matter much? The primary party that loses out from the cheating is the cheater because they will fail to learn Sure, I suppose. But the secondary effect is that others with the same Uni degree now have their degree valued less in the eyes of whomever hires the cheater and they fail to do their job right. Or, much worse, the cheater gets someone hurt or killed. Tech can kill people--just ask Boeing (guess who has large hiring events at my Uni!). > Universities will not confirm or deny if a particular party got a degree Hmm. I've had several jobs in the past which, as a contingency of being hired, must show proof of a Uni degree via official transcripts. Mine charges $12 for the privilege of printing out your record on "official paper", stamping it, and mailing it to your presumptive employer (or grad school) on demand.

nullc 2y ago
> Or, much worse, the cheater gets someone hurt or killed. Tech can kill people--just ask Boeing (guess who has large hiring events at my Uni!). Do you think cheating was a major factor there? Or has Boeing just been prioritizing things like cost over other considerations? For life critical engineering roles it would be entirely reasonable to test candidates. If an org like Boeing fails to do so, it has to be because they just don't prioritize the candidate's capability. Of course someone could cheat some but otherwise study and still pass the test, but I think those candidates will already be pretty job performance indistinguishable from people who didn't cheat. A degree only means so much at best. > I've had several jobs in the past which, as a contingency of being hired, must show proof of a Uni degree via official transcripts. I'm aware of that practice, though I've never experienced it first hand and you're only the second person who has told me that they've experienced it. In any case, it's easily faked if you're willing to be bold about it, particularly where you've enrolled previously (even briefly) -- get a transcript sent to yourself, make a duplicate that says what you want, send that in. Even if your forgery is not very good it is extremely unlikely to get a careful inspection because faked credentials are not currently recognized to be a widespread problem. In practice this kind of validation is rare, so even if you're unwilling to go the master-forger route you're just limited somewhat in your hiring pool. Somewhat ironically, hiring hoops seem to be more common for lower tier position. If your fake degrees aren't working, fake some more and apply as CEO. :D Even in court I've had difficulty dealing with a party faking their credentials via bare assertion.
- agiacalone 2y ago
  Interesting, and I don't disagree that it can be faked...but that's a whole other issue. For example sake about one of the jobs: it was for a project management position in a big old tech company with three letters.

gizmo686 2y ago

> Universities will not confirm or deny if a particular party got a degree, citing privacy laws. For a nominal fee, universities will send a copy of your transcript to anyone you ask them to. Every job I have had since graduating has asked me to ask my university to send them a copy.