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This is why I was excited about Libra (later renamed to Diem.) which was Meta's feeless digital currency that was scrapped. It could have been a Western WeChat

by cedws 2y ago

This is why I was excited about Libra (later renamed to Diem.) which was Meta's feeless digital currency that was scrapped. It could have been a Western WeChat Pay, which charges no fees up to 200 RMB ~= 20 GBP. I don't see why they should get to shave a slice off of every transaction. It takes relatively little upkeep and they rake in huge profits. The fees nudge businesses to use cash (well, to avoid tax too, sometimes.) or set a minimum transaction amount, which can mean fewer customers through the door. I think a new, public infrastructure competitor could be healthy for economies worldwide.

multjoy 2y ago
Cash has a processing cost to business as well, sometimes more than card processing fees. Not only do you have to pay to deposit, you have to store it, count it, secure it and transport it.
- Atotalnoob 2y ago
  You also have to “buy” change. Banks don’t give bulk change that a cash business needs for free. You have to purchase standard denominations to give as change
trompetenaccoun 2y ago
It was not just "scrapped", they were basically forbidden from going ahead by regulators protecting the incumbents. It's the same problem all cryptocurrency projects face. They allowed Bitcoin because Bitcoin is basically useless for payments, it's too slow and fees are way too expensive. Though Ethereum recently slipping through the cracks may disrupt the payments industry in a big way. Coinbase and Circle are already working on bringing direct stablecoin payment options to customers/merchants with USDC and other tokens afaik. Which would also be more decentralized than Facebook's Diem. Not sure how many people would trust corporate money, an open public ledger is preferable of course. https://www.ft.com/content/a88fb591-72d5-4b6b-bb5d-223adfb893f3 https://www.ft.com/content/a88fb591-72d5-4b6b-bb5d-223adfb89... https://www.dw.com/en/facebook-backed-cryptocurrency-sold-amid-regulatory-pressure/a-60616823 https://www.dw.com/en/facebook-backed-cryptocurrency-sold-am...
- RunSet 2y ago
  > They allowed Bitcoin because Bitcoin is basically useless for payments, it's too slow and fees are way too expensive. Though Ethereum recently slipping through the cracks may disrupt the payments industry in a big way. Or authorities "allowed" Bitcoin because, given its lack of head to cut off, they had no choice. Contrast with Ethereum's demonstrable central authority over its blockchain: When the developers were robbed of their coin by a hacker, they "reorganized" the Ethereum blockchain to undo the transactions associated with the theft.[0] I regard Ethereum less as "slipping through the cracks" and more as a poison suppository greased and inserted by the powers that be. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethereum_Classic#The_DAO_bailout https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethereum_Classic#The_DAO_bailo...
  - RamblingCTO 2y ago
    You give plenty of examples yourself as to why it might be considered something worth prohibiting? It enables fraud above all else and doesn't offer undoing of errors from a users perspective, and thus it will never replace any of the things OP mentioned.
TimJRobinson 2y ago
Coinbase + USDC are essentialy this now. They've started working with many merchants both in the real world and online to add USDC pay and transactions are less than a cent with Coinbase charging no additional fees.
- avnfish 2y ago
  Yep, plus Apple is opening up the NFC API for tap to pay. I could easily see merchants accept both cards (2%+8c) and USDC (0%) at point of sale
  - joshstrange 2y ago
    2%+8c alone seems unheard of and the idea of normal people using USDC is laughable. Have you interacted with the general public? Heck, even if it was as easy as Apple Pay or NFC tap with a card most people still wouldn’t do it, look at financial literacy in this country.

by cedws 2y ago

multjoy 2y ago

Cash has a processing cost to business as well, sometimes more than card processing fees. Not only do you have to pay to deposit, you have to store it, count it, secure it and transport it.

Atotalnoob 2y ago
You also have to “buy” change. Banks don’t give bulk change that a cash business needs for free. You have to purchase standard denominations to give as change

trompetenaccoun 2y ago

It was not just "scrapped", they were basically forbidden from going ahead by regulators protecting the incumbents. It's the same problem all cryptocurrency projects face. They allowed Bitcoin because Bitcoin is basically useless for payments, it's too slow and fees are way too expensive. Though Ethereum recently slipping through the cracks may disrupt the payments industry in a big way. Coinbase and Circle are already working on bringing direct stablecoin payment options to customers/merchants with USDC and other tokens afaik. Which would also be more decentralized than Facebook's Diem. Not sure how many people would trust corporate money, an open public ledger is preferable of course. https://www.ft.com/content/a88fb591-72d5-4b6b-bb5d-223adfb893f3 https://www.ft.com/content/a88fb591-72d5-4b6b-bb5d-223adfb89... https://www.dw.com/en/facebook-backed-cryptocurrency-sold-amid-regulatory-pressure/a-60616823 https://www.dw.com/en/facebook-backed-cryptocurrency-sold-am...

RunSet 2y ago
> They allowed Bitcoin because Bitcoin is basically useless for payments, it's too slow and fees are way too expensive. Though Ethereum recently slipping through the cracks may disrupt the payments industry in a big way. Or authorities "allowed" Bitcoin because, given its lack of head to cut off, they had no choice. Contrast with Ethereum's demonstrable central authority over its blockchain: When the developers were robbed of their coin by a hacker, they "reorganized" the Ethereum blockchain to undo the transactions associated with the theft.[0] I regard Ethereum less as "slipping through the cracks" and more as a poison suppository greased and inserted by the powers that be. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethereum_Classic#The_DAO_bailout https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethereum_Classic#The_DAO_bailo...
- RamblingCTO 2y ago
  You give plenty of examples yourself as to why it might be considered something worth prohibiting? It enables fraud above all else and doesn't offer undoing of errors from a users perspective, and thus it will never replace any of the things OP mentioned.

TimJRobinson 2y ago

Coinbase + USDC are essentialy this now. They've started working with many merchants both in the real world and online to add USDC pay and transactions are less than a cent with Coinbase charging no additional fees.

avnfish 2y ago
Yep, plus Apple is opening up the NFC API for tap to pay. I could easily see merchants accept both cards (2%+8c) and USDC (0%) at point of sale
- joshstrange 2y ago
  2%+8c alone seems unheard of and the idea of normal people using USDC is laughable. Have you interacted with the general public? Heck, even if it was as easy as Apple Pay or NFC tap with a card most people still wouldn’t do it, look at financial literacy in this country.