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They want to sow discord. Manipulating US politics in any meaningful way is difficult to do. It's easier to divide and conquer and turn your enemy against itsel

by cedws 2y ago

They want to sow discord. Manipulating US politics in any meaningful way is difficult to do. It's easier to divide and conquer and turn your enemy against itself. In my opinion the West is already doing a good enough job at polarising itself, doesn't need much help from the enemy.

zmgsabst 2y ago
Of course we are: Domestic enemies came to the same conclusion.
ants_everywhere 2y ago
> Manipulating US politics in any meaningful way is difficult to do. Well empirically it's actually pretty cheap and easy. What's expensive and hard are the countermeasures against it. To manipulate politics you mainly need to generate fake social proof. To do it effectively you mainly need to target a relatively small number of counties in battleground states.
- canjobear 2y ago
  Do you have examples in mind of successful foreign manipulation of US politics?
  - mandmandam 2y ago
    Not sure if you're serious, but just in case: Have you ever heard of AIPAC? Rupert Murdoch? The UAE? Chainsaw dismembering princes getting a free pass with their weapons purchases? If you're only into corporate news, there's Russia in 2016 scapegoating for terrible decisions from the DNC.
  - ants_everywhere 2y ago
    I'm honestly a little perplexed but this question. It's a bit like asking if there's any proof that marketing works. Or that campaign ads work. Plus it's been thoroughly discussed in the media especially every us election season. But assuming you're asking in good faith the obvious one is Russian interference in the 2016 election, which the former head of the NSA considers > the most successful covert influence operation in history Another former director of the NSA said > it stretches credulity to think the Russians didn't turn the election The Wikipedia article is a good entry point if you're not familiar with the details [0]. After the election, the Russian government had scandal-making influence in many positions including the National Security Advisor. The US seems to believe these tactics work because we use similar ones to influence foreign governments. For example you can read about US involvement in the Arab spring [1]. A lot of the techniques are the same, but things weren't quite as online then. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_interference_in_the_2016_United_States_elections https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_interference_in_the_20... [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/15/world/15aid.html https://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/15/world/15aid.html

by cedws 2y ago

zmgsabst 2y ago

Of course we are: Domestic enemies came to the same conclusion.

ants_everywhere 2y ago

> Manipulating US politics in any meaningful way is difficult to do. Well empirically it's actually pretty cheap and easy. What's expensive and hard are the countermeasures against it. To manipulate politics you mainly need to generate fake social proof. To do it effectively you mainly need to target a relatively small number of counties in battleground states.

canjobear 2y ago
Do you have examples in mind of successful foreign manipulation of US politics?
- mandmandam 2y ago
  Not sure if you're serious, but just in case: Have you ever heard of AIPAC? Rupert Murdoch? The UAE? Chainsaw dismembering princes getting a free pass with their weapons purchases? If you're only into corporate news, there's Russia in 2016 scapegoating for terrible decisions from the DNC.
- ants_everywhere 2y ago
  I'm honestly a little perplexed but this question. It's a bit like asking if there's any proof that marketing works. Or that campaign ads work. Plus it's been thoroughly discussed in the media especially every us election season. But assuming you're asking in good faith the obvious one is Russian interference in the 2016 election, which the former head of the NSA considers > the most successful covert influence operation in history Another former director of the NSA said > it stretches credulity to think the Russians didn't turn the election The Wikipedia article is a good entry point if you're not familiar with the details [0]. After the election, the Russian government had scandal-making influence in many positions including the National Security Advisor. The US seems to believe these tactics work because we use similar ones to influence foreign governments. For example you can read about US involvement in the Arab spring [1]. A lot of the techniques are the same, but things weren't quite as online then. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_interference_in_the_2016_United_States_elections https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_interference_in_the_20... [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/15/world/15aid.html https://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/15/world/15aid.html