3 ms·

When you're talking about "evil" and percentages of life spent in jail, I'm going to ask for a more direct causal link to harm than just "demonstration is trivi

When you're talking about "evil" and percentages of life spent in jail, I'm going to ask for a more direct causal link to harm than just "demonstration is trivial and left to the reader". 1s and 0s can be sending bitcoin to a hit man to kill your wife. In this case, link to harm is indeed obvious, and evil and years in jail are justified. Can you argue for something similar for generated CP? And also discount the ick factor?

batch12 2y ago
> When you're talking about "evil" and percentages of life spent in jail, I'm going to ask for a more direct causal link to harm than just "demonstration is trivial and left to the reader. I don't know if theres a correlation between evil and jailtime. The debate around the severity of punishment is different than the debate about whether or not something should be illegal. I do think my (US) justice system is very flawed, especially around sentencing. > Can you argue for something similar for generated CP? And also discount the ick factor? I can take a stab at it. Simulated CSAM : * if realistic, can make identifying real CSAM and the associated victims more difficult. This could redirect resources dedicated to stopping harm against victims. * has the potential to normalize the distribution of CSAM due to #1 * has the potential to normalize the consumption of CSAM. To address the comments being birthed around unproven causal relationships- yeah I know. The parent asked for arguments. Besides, a study into this doesn't seem very ethical or possible. I am not able to discount the "ick factor", but I'll try to make a counterpoint. All of the arguments I can think of to the contrary center around free speech, false positives and weaponization. That's where I think the challenges are and where subjectivity can cause issues. Without a real person, it's difficult to assign a simulated age unless a prompt is captured or other context. Otherwise it becomes the job of a person or other 'AI' to guess the simulated age of the image.
- shaky-carrousel 2y ago
  > if realistic, can make identifying real CSAM and the associated victims more difficult. This could redirect resources dedicated to stopping harm against victims. Yes, but at the same time it'll greatly devaluate the real CSAM. It'll be like flooding the black market of perfect copies of rhinoceros horns. People won't have any economic incentive to create real CSAM.
  - batch12 2y ago
    Perhaps. I can't speak to the motivation of these folks, but I suspect it's more than just sending the pictures for them. Also, even if the market is flooded, I imagine we'd still want people looking for victims so it doesn't really help.
phone8675309 2y ago
[flagged]
- dang 2y ago
  We've banned this account. Whatever you're arguing for or against (and I'm not tracking it), you can't attack another user this way on this site. If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future. They're here: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html.
MrDrMcCoy 2y ago
Child porn consumption is a product of an unhealthy addiction. Addicts tend to need more and more extreme fixes to feed upon. In the case of drugs, that generally leads to self harm. In the case of child porn, a child ever more likely is to be harmed.

batch12 2y ago

> When you're talking about "evil" and percentages of life spent in jail, I'm going to ask for a more direct causal link to harm than just "demonstration is trivial and left to the reader. I don't know if theres a correlation between evil and jailtime. The debate around the severity of punishment is different than the debate about whether or not something should be illegal. I do think my (US) justice system is very flawed, especially around sentencing. > Can you argue for something similar for generated CP? And also discount the ick factor? I can take a stab at it. Simulated CSAM : * if realistic, can make identifying real CSAM and the associated victims more difficult. This could redirect resources dedicated to stopping harm against victims. * has the potential to normalize the distribution of CSAM due to #1 * has the potential to normalize the consumption of CSAM. To address the comments being birthed around unproven causal relationships- yeah I know. The parent asked for arguments. Besides, a study into this doesn't seem very ethical or possible. I am not able to discount the "ick factor", but I'll try to make a counterpoint. All of the arguments I can think of to the contrary center around free speech, false positives and weaponization. That's where I think the challenges are and where subjectivity can cause issues. Without a real person, it's difficult to assign a simulated age unless a prompt is captured or other context. Otherwise it becomes the job of a person or other 'AI' to guess the simulated age of the image.

shaky-carrousel 2y ago
> if realistic, can make identifying real CSAM and the associated victims more difficult. This could redirect resources dedicated to stopping harm against victims. Yes, but at the same time it'll greatly devaluate the real CSAM. It'll be like flooding the black market of perfect copies of rhinoceros horns. People won't have any economic incentive to create real CSAM.
- batch12 2y ago
  Perhaps. I can't speak to the motivation of these folks, but I suspect it's more than just sending the pictures for them. Also, even if the market is flooded, I imagine we'd still want people looking for victims so it doesn't really help.

phone8675309 2y ago

[flagged]

dang 2y ago
We've banned this account. Whatever you're arguing for or against (and I'm not tracking it), you can't attack another user this way on this site. If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future. They're here: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html.

MrDrMcCoy 2y ago

Child porn consumption is a product of an unhealthy addiction. Addicts tend to need more and more extreme fixes to feed upon. In the case of drugs, that generally leads to self harm. In the case of child porn, a child ever more likely is to be harmed.