4 ms·

It's crazy to think that one of the oldest religious stories, the whole Adam and Eve don't eat from the fruit of the forbidden tree of knowledge, actually has a

It's crazy to think that one of the oldest religious stories, the whole Adam and Eve don't eat from the fruit of the forbidden tree of knowledge, actually has a coincidence (...I mean, I believe it was a coincidence) in our past diet https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2017/03/27/521423216/what-gave-some-primates-bigger-brains-a-fruit-filled-diet https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2017/03/27/521423216/wh... I don't believe pre-human primates somehow passed that story down or anything but old stories always make me curious into their origins. Sometimes cool and interesting stuff comes up when you do

gowld 2y ago
Fruit is great, as described. Knowing fruit is great is of course adaptive and this receives selective presure. Most life forms naturally seek out the things that they need to survive. Intelligent beings will use their intelligence to seek out such things, and will understand their value.
krapp 2y ago
I've been told the whole Genesis narrative was essentially political propaganda based on the Babylonian creation account in the Enuma Elish and written during the Babylonian exile. I don't know how accurate that is but they do share similarities and given the relative cultural influence of Babylon I wouldn't doubt some influence was there.
- giraffe_lady 2y ago
  Those are basically two different theories to account for the similarities. The one where the hebrews picked up the myth during captivity in babylon is mostly out of favor currently though it has some reputable proponents. "Political propaganda" isn't quite how I would put it but yes a slightly more main stream theory is that genesis is an intentional reconfiguration of a myth that would have been widely known in the region, for the purpose of repudiating the mesopotamian religion in favor of the hebrew one. Either way, or both, or neither, the story was "in the air" in the eastern mediterranean/west asia at that time. It was widely known and incredibly influential, and bits of it turn up in basically all significant literature with its roots in that place & era. Scholars go back and forth on the archeological and linguistic evidence but it's fairly commonly held that they are all simply a mesh of mutually-influenced variants of an even earlier myth that was lost or never recorded in its "original" form.
trhway 2y ago
And not just fruit - getting ability to metabolize alcohol, ie. to efficiently consume those ripe fruits lying around under the tree seems to be that jump start in the brain development, walking up-right, etc. And the alcohol produces that artificial feeling of empowerment and freedom (which are basically top temptations by the devil). Btw, in Russia alcohol has evil image of the "green serpent" (after the biblical Serpent, and the Soviet propaganda used all that religious imagery - a 1962 cartoon where moonshine distillator is ran by a Witch and a Daemon and it morphs into the Serpent, and there is also a Faust's Mefistofele signing the famous solo of the opera https://youtu.be/xa7VHwpCgDk?t=352 https://youtu.be/xa7VHwpCgDk?t=352 and https://youtu.be/xa7VHwpCgDk?t=482 https://youtu.be/xa7VHwpCgDk?t=482 )
x3n0ph3n3 2y ago
> the whole Adam and Eve don't eat from the fruit of the forbidden tree of knowledge knowledge of good and evil It's so odd how often nuance from the bible is lost. Just like people say "money is the root of all evil" when the quote is actually " the love of money is the root of all evil. These are actually important distinctions. From a literary perspective, knowledge didn't cause the downfall of Adam and Eve, it was awareness of morality that did. Money is just a tool, but love of money is a motivation that leads to evil actions.
- hughesjj 2y ago
  Oh dang, that's even more interesting
- CoastalCoder 2y ago
  Continuing with your points, I've been told that "... is the root of all evil" is likely an idiomatic use of hyperbole. I.e., in modern colloquial English we'd say, "The love of money is the root of all kinds of evil."
- chimpanzee 2y ago
  > knowledge of good and evil This translation shouldn't necessarily be taken to mean solely awareness of morality. The knowledge of good and evil, being opposites, would in fact include the knowledge of everything. It's a literary device, like the phrases day and night or heaven and earth.

gowld 2y ago

Fruit is great, as described. Knowing fruit is great is of course adaptive and this receives selective presure. Most life forms naturally seek out the things that they need to survive. Intelligent beings will use their intelligence to seek out such things, and will understand their value.

krapp 2y ago

I've been told the whole Genesis narrative was essentially political propaganda based on the Babylonian creation account in the Enuma Elish and written during the Babylonian exile. I don't know how accurate that is but they do share similarities and given the relative cultural influence of Babylon I wouldn't doubt some influence was there.

giraffe_lady 2y ago
Those are basically two different theories to account for the similarities. The one where the hebrews picked up the myth during captivity in babylon is mostly out of favor currently though it has some reputable proponents. "Political propaganda" isn't quite how I would put it but yes a slightly more main stream theory is that genesis is an intentional reconfiguration of a myth that would have been widely known in the region, for the purpose of repudiating the mesopotamian religion in favor of the hebrew one. Either way, or both, or neither, the story was "in the air" in the eastern mediterranean/west asia at that time. It was widely known and incredibly influential, and bits of it turn up in basically all significant literature with its roots in that place & era. Scholars go back and forth on the archeological and linguistic evidence but it's fairly commonly held that they are all simply a mesh of mutually-influenced variants of an even earlier myth that was lost or never recorded in its "original" form.

trhway 2y ago

And not just fruit - getting ability to metabolize alcohol, ie. to efficiently consume those ripe fruits lying around under the tree seems to be that jump start in the brain development, walking up-right, etc. And the alcohol produces that artificial feeling of empowerment and freedom (which are basically top temptations by the devil). Btw, in Russia alcohol has evil image of the "green serpent" (after the biblical Serpent, and the Soviet propaganda used all that religious imagery - a 1962 cartoon where moonshine distillator is ran by a Witch and a Daemon and it morphs into the Serpent, and there is also a Faust's Mefistofele signing the famous solo of the opera https://youtu.be/xa7VHwpCgDk?t=352 https://youtu.be/xa7VHwpCgDk?t=352 and https://youtu.be/xa7VHwpCgDk?t=482 https://youtu.be/xa7VHwpCgDk?t=482 )

x3n0ph3n3 2y ago

> the whole Adam and Eve don't eat from the fruit of the forbidden tree of knowledge knowledge of good and evil It's so odd how often nuance from the bible is lost. Just like people say "money is the root of all evil" when the quote is actually " the love of money is the root of all evil. These are actually important distinctions. From a literary perspective, knowledge didn't cause the downfall of Adam and Eve, it was awareness of morality that did. Money is just a tool, but love of money is a motivation that leads to evil actions.

hughesjj 2y ago
Oh dang, that's even more interesting
CoastalCoder 2y ago
Continuing with your points, I've been told that "... is the root of all evil" is likely an idiomatic use of hyperbole. I.e., in modern colloquial English we'd say, "The love of money is the root of all kinds of evil."
chimpanzee 2y ago
> knowledge of good and evil This translation shouldn't necessarily be taken to mean solely awareness of morality. The knowledge of good and evil, being opposites, would in fact include the knowledge of everything. It's a literary device, like the phrases day and night or heaven and earth.