5 ms·

Had my first kid this year. Will definitely be having more. Does it require a less comfy and selfish lifestyle? Definitely. I'll get to my deathbed and regret n

Had my first kid this year. Will definitely be having more. Does it require a less comfy and selfish lifestyle? Definitely. I'll get to my deathbed and regret not having a family of my own to enjoy time with. Pro tip: it's always been "the wrong time" to have kids. It never gets good enough to be easy.

nashashmi 2y ago
> the wrong time Would you consider lack of marriage stability as a reason to not have kids yet?
- thisOtterBeGood 2y ago
  No. We have two kids and have been agreeing on a third. There are no rational arguments for another child: We will sacrifice sleep, money, self-entertainment. It always results in more work for parents.
- benterix 2y ago
  Definitely. I believe most people would see the "wrong time" as lack of financial stability. Not being able to depend on a partner is a recipe for a broken family and not a very happy lifer for the child (first-hand experience).
- seanw444 2y ago
  Yeah. I was mostly directing that towards the "the world is going to shit" crowd. I'm also a part of that crowd, but it irks me when people think we're in a unique situation. The world's always been going to shit. It goes to shit in rather short cycles.
  - trilbyglens 2y ago
    previous "going to shit" cycles didn't have the possibility of ending the habitable era of our planet.
    - nashashmi 2y ago
      Unfortunately for the dooms day warners this is a hypothesis. Not a scientific fact. We actually have no clue how the earth will cope with rising temperatures. Remember in the era of the rise of civilizations, earth was five degrees warmer than today. So we will be fine now and later
nativespecies 2y ago
So not having kids is selfish? Ha. Ok.
- carlmr 2y ago
  I see a lot of parents say this. They somehow think their kids are a gift to the world. To me climate change, overpopulation causing insane resource consumption make it look kind of selfish when people want their own kids. I understand that in terms of social systems we "need" more kids to support the old. But at the same time these kids will grow old at some point as well, and if you always need more kids than old people that means you need growth forever, which just means you're kicking the can down the road and creating more environmental issues in the meantime. Have kids, don't have kids, whatever. But don't pretend like you did something selfless. If people were having more kids we'd just have a bigger demographic collapse in the future.
  - seanw444 2y ago
    You guys read way into my message. I didn't say not having kids is selfish. I said having kids requires a less selfish lifestyle.
    - toomuchtodo 2y ago
      To have children is a selfish choice, parents are just pushing the selfishness from fun/self consumption to reproductive consumption, like squeezing a balloon. As you said: > I'll get to my deathbed and regret not having a family of my own to enjoy time with. Is that not selfish? Making humans to fill your time? Humans who are in no way guaranteed to want to spend time with you between adulthood and your death [1] [2]? I'm not going to argue against it in this thread, but let's call a spade a spade. I can respect "I am selfish and am making this choice, consequences be damned," but lets not dress up having kids as a noble cause when there are 8 billion people on the planet. Not directed at you, but a phrase I use often with people considering kids is "Do you need kids? Or therapy?" Enumerate why you are making this decision, and provide evidence supporting this decision. The worst I hear, far too often, is "I'm having a kid so someone will love me forever." Big oof, let me tell you how that goes. I'm arguing for more thought and intention into the default choice, because the outcome is mostly permanent and a one way door. Is it worse to regret not having kids? Or regret having had them? ~40% of annual pregnancies, in both the US and internationally, are unintentional (per the Guttmacher Institute and the UN, respectively), so I think folks who really want to have kids aren't going to be material as long as those folks who don't want them have their reproductive freedoms affirmed. [1] https://www.vogue.com/article/why-so-many-people-are-experiencing-family-estrangement https://www.vogue.com/article/why-so-many-people-are-experie... [2] https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/brothers-sisters-strangers/202402/statistics-that-tell-the-story-of-family-estrangement https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/brothers-sisters-str...

nashashmi 2y ago

> the wrong time Would you consider lack of marriage stability as a reason to not have kids yet?

thisOtterBeGood 2y ago
No. We have two kids and have been agreeing on a third. There are no rational arguments for another child: We will sacrifice sleep, money, self-entertainment. It always results in more work for parents.
benterix 2y ago
Definitely. I believe most people would see the "wrong time" as lack of financial stability. Not being able to depend on a partner is a recipe for a broken family and not a very happy lifer for the child (first-hand experience).
seanw444 2y ago
Yeah. I was mostly directing that towards the "the world is going to shit" crowd. I'm also a part of that crowd, but it irks me when people think we're in a unique situation. The world's always been going to shit. It goes to shit in rather short cycles.
- trilbyglens 2y ago
  previous "going to shit" cycles didn't have the possibility of ending the habitable era of our planet.
  - nashashmi 2y ago
    Unfortunately for the dooms day warners this is a hypothesis. Not a scientific fact. We actually have no clue how the earth will cope with rising temperatures. Remember in the era of the rise of civilizations, earth was five degrees warmer than today. So we will be fine now and later

nativespecies 2y ago

So not having kids is selfish? Ha. Ok.

carlmr 2y ago
I see a lot of parents say this. They somehow think their kids are a gift to the world. To me climate change, overpopulation causing insane resource consumption make it look kind of selfish when people want their own kids. I understand that in terms of social systems we "need" more kids to support the old. But at the same time these kids will grow old at some point as well, and if you always need more kids than old people that means you need growth forever, which just means you're kicking the can down the road and creating more environmental issues in the meantime. Have kids, don't have kids, whatever. But don't pretend like you did something selfless. If people were having more kids we'd just have a bigger demographic collapse in the future.
- seanw444 2y ago
  You guys read way into my message. I didn't say not having kids is selfish. I said having kids requires a less selfish lifestyle.
  - toomuchtodo 2y ago
    To have children is a selfish choice, parents are just pushing the selfishness from fun/self consumption to reproductive consumption, like squeezing a balloon. As you said: > I'll get to my deathbed and regret not having a family of my own to enjoy time with. Is that not selfish? Making humans to fill your time? Humans who are in no way guaranteed to want to spend time with you between adulthood and your death [1] [2]? I'm not going to argue against it in this thread, but let's call a spade a spade. I can respect "I am selfish and am making this choice, consequences be damned," but lets not dress up having kids as a noble cause when there are 8 billion people on the planet. Not directed at you, but a phrase I use often with people considering kids is "Do you need kids? Or therapy?" Enumerate why you are making this decision, and provide evidence supporting this decision. The worst I hear, far too often, is "I'm having a kid so someone will love me forever." Big oof, let me tell you how that goes. I'm arguing for more thought and intention into the default choice, because the outcome is mostly permanent and a one way door. Is it worse to regret not having kids? Or regret having had them? ~40% of annual pregnancies, in both the US and internationally, are unintentional (per the Guttmacher Institute and the UN, respectively), so I think folks who really want to have kids aren't going to be material as long as those folks who don't want them have their reproductive freedoms affirmed. [1] https://www.vogue.com/article/why-so-many-people-are-experiencing-family-estrangement https://www.vogue.com/article/why-so-many-people-are-experie... [2] https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/brothers-sisters-strangers/202402/statistics-that-tell-the-story-of-family-estrangement https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/brothers-sisters-str...