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Do apple at the same time and I'll support it. How long are we going to allow the 30% apple tax to continue? See the recent patreon debacle for how it hurts pe

Do apple at the same time and I'll support it. How long are we going to allow the 30% apple tax to continue? See the recent patreon debacle for how it hurts people (not to mention the 30% being eaten as apple as well...). You could switch from using Google's web products today. Literally.

Fnoord 2y ago
Do one now, by focusing on it. Then do other. It is difficult to compete with 'free' services where people pay with their privacy / time (for watching ads). Large masses cannot afford all these subscription-based models, and if then: households need to chose. Amazon does this too. I pay 5 EUR a month, and get Amazon Prime Video, I get free S&H on Prime articles, and this makes me more inclined to order from Amazon. Meanwhile, if I order from AliExpress for more than 10 EUR, I get free shipping. Same story: stimulates me to buy more (or wait till I have more to order). With Apple, people are within the walled garden and circumventing that isn't allowed outside of EU. Small businesses cannot do free/cheap shipping, as they don't have any large volume discounts. So what they do is sell their item on Amazon (and in NL, Bol.com) for a little bit more than their own shop. Either way, they have a tough time to compete. On service perhaps. Amazon has been terrible with warranty on expensive items to me. But if it is within a month I've been able to return the item, with no hassle.
heavyset_go 2y ago
I'm hoping precedent is set so that actions can be taken against other companies that abuse their monopoly/duopoly/etc status to dominate markets with anti-competitive policies.
reissbaker 2y ago
Apple is so clearly an active, harmful monopoly with clear consumer pricing harm (forced 30% tax, you can't even mention alternative payment processing or they'll ban your app), and the DOJ and FTC consistently ignore it; I've pretty much lost hope in the honesty of the American regulators at this point. Enforce the law consistently, or don't enforce it; trying to pick winners with this degree of selective enforcement should be a crime.
- concinds 2y ago
  The DOJ suit against Apple was such a bizarre disappointment. Didn't address any of the big problems. Focused on minor stuff no one cares about (like "everything apps", or allowing third-party apps to take over SMS handling)
jsjohnst 2y ago
[flagged]
- flutas 2y ago
  Yawn > How long are we going to let the Google Play store tax continue? Alternative: Offer your app for download as an APK, or on alternative 3rd party app stores. > How about the Uber and Lyft and <insert other driver/delivery service> 30% tax continue? Alternative: Become an actual taxi driver / ask [location] if they want to hire delivery/(keyword: catering) drivers > How long are we going to let Amazon take 30-40% of sales on their platform from manufacturers / merchants? Alternative: Don't sell on Amazon, people have alternative shopping options. > How long are we going to let Walmart take upwards of 50% in some cases? Alternative: Don't sell in Walmart stores, people have alternative shopping options. > Sure, Apple be damned, but can we stop pretending like they are unusual here? Notice that each and every option you list out has alternative options for the person selling/conducting business through the platform that doesn't cut off their access to ~half of consumers in the US. What is the alternative for Apple?
Narhem 2y ago
Honestly we need an entirely new “technology” stacks to provide alternatives to the monopoly that either the stock market has or the secret conglomerate of Silicon Valley.
danaris 2y ago
> Do apple at the same time and I'll support it. For better or for worse, that's not how these things work. Each antitrust case is almost wholly independent, with the only things that connect them being potential precedent set by previous ones, and any evidence or testimony that comes from one company to hang the other. While it would surely be satisfying to see one big rollup of "big tech antitrust breakups" announced at once, and while it would help to mitigate the potential of breaking up one company to strengthen its rivals, our system just isn't set up to allow that sort of thing in any fashion. If you want Google to be broken up, you have to support Google being broken up without knowing if Apple will even lose their antitrust case, let alone what the remedies might be. (Not, of course, that our opinion has any significant sway over these things in the first place!)
tarsinge 2y ago
I don’t understand this argument, Google is a giant monopoly worldwide in many markets compared to Apple who only has a slight advantage in only one market. Google own the web (search), mail (Gmail), maps (Gmail), videos (YouTube), smartphone (Android)… Apple is smartphones in the US.

Fnoord 2y ago

Do one now, by focusing on it. Then do other. It is difficult to compete with 'free' services where people pay with their privacy / time (for watching ads). Large masses cannot afford all these subscription-based models, and if then: households need to chose. Amazon does this too. I pay 5 EUR a month, and get Amazon Prime Video, I get free S&H on Prime articles, and this makes me more inclined to order from Amazon. Meanwhile, if I order from AliExpress for more than 10 EUR, I get free shipping. Same story: stimulates me to buy more (or wait till I have more to order). With Apple, people are within the walled garden and circumventing that isn't allowed outside of EU. Small businesses cannot do free/cheap shipping, as they don't have any large volume discounts. So what they do is sell their item on Amazon (and in NL, Bol.com) for a little bit more than their own shop. Either way, they have a tough time to compete. On service perhaps. Amazon has been terrible with warranty on expensive items to me. But if it is within a month I've been able to return the item, with no hassle.

heavyset_go 2y ago

I'm hoping precedent is set so that actions can be taken against other companies that abuse their monopoly/duopoly/etc status to dominate markets with anti-competitive policies.

reissbaker 2y ago

Apple is so clearly an active, harmful monopoly with clear consumer pricing harm (forced 30% tax, you can't even mention alternative payment processing or they'll ban your app), and the DOJ and FTC consistently ignore it; I've pretty much lost hope in the honesty of the American regulators at this point. Enforce the law consistently, or don't enforce it; trying to pick winners with this degree of selective enforcement should be a crime.

concinds 2y ago
The DOJ suit against Apple was such a bizarre disappointment. Didn't address any of the big problems. Focused on minor stuff no one cares about (like "everything apps", or allowing third-party apps to take over SMS handling)

jsjohnst 2y ago

[flagged]

flutas 2y ago
Yawn > How long are we going to let the Google Play store tax continue? Alternative: Offer your app for download as an APK, or on alternative 3rd party app stores. > How about the Uber and Lyft and <insert other driver/delivery service> 30% tax continue? Alternative: Become an actual taxi driver / ask [location] if they want to hire delivery/(keyword: catering) drivers > How long are we going to let Amazon take 30-40% of sales on their platform from manufacturers / merchants? Alternative: Don't sell on Amazon, people have alternative shopping options. > How long are we going to let Walmart take upwards of 50% in some cases? Alternative: Don't sell in Walmart stores, people have alternative shopping options. > Sure, Apple be damned, but can we stop pretending like they are unusual here? Notice that each and every option you list out has alternative options for the person selling/conducting business through the platform that doesn't cut off their access to ~half of consumers in the US. What is the alternative for Apple?

Narhem 2y ago

Honestly we need an entirely new “technology” stacks to provide alternatives to the monopoly that either the stock market has or the secret conglomerate of Silicon Valley.

danaris 2y ago

> Do apple at the same time and I'll support it. For better or for worse, that's not how these things work. Each antitrust case is almost wholly independent, with the only things that connect them being potential precedent set by previous ones, and any evidence or testimony that comes from one company to hang the other. While it would surely be satisfying to see one big rollup of "big tech antitrust breakups" announced at once, and while it would help to mitigate the potential of breaking up one company to strengthen its rivals, our system just isn't set up to allow that sort of thing in any fashion. If you want Google to be broken up, you have to support Google being broken up without knowing if Apple will even lose their antitrust case, let alone what the remedies might be. (Not, of course, that our opinion has any significant sway over these things in the first place!)

tarsinge 2y ago

I don’t understand this argument, Google is a giant monopoly worldwide in many markets compared to Apple who only has a slight advantage in only one market. Google own the web (search), mail (Gmail), maps (Gmail), videos (YouTube), smartphone (Android)… Apple is smartphones in the US.