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This is no more likely than malthusian predictions of over population leading to mass starvation. It turns out that human populations self regulate when a basic

by dbspin 2y ago

This is no more likely than malthusian predictions of over population leading to mass starvation. It turns out that human populations self regulate when a basic level of needs are met.

alexey-salmin 2y ago
Yes, the self-regulation mechanism is that cultures that produce too many "problem with pronatalism" articles get regulated away.
smallmancontrov 2y ago
Agreed, but if we build an economy that maximizes extraction by artificially threatening basic needs, we could stay in the exponential decline for quite some time.
pfdietz 2y ago
The feedback mechanism used to be that societies with inadequate birth rates were conquered and replaced.
- Attrecomet 2y ago
  And now, thanks to increased control over the environment due to technology and science, there are new tools in our repository that our ancestors did not have, like actually sitting down and planning how to avoid an ecological collapse -- and waging war with advanced weapons that negate a pure "breed fast" strategy. It sure would be nice if we didn't have to return to regular periods of widespread starvation like they did back in the Middle Ages, when they were too uninformed to not remove all forests and powerless to avoid staying away from the carrying capacity of their world for any amount of time.
- Muromec 2y ago
  no need to conquer anybody — just fuck up the rest of the world and get net population increase through immigration from places where people don’t want to live
- fallingknife 2y ago
  Used to be? It's happening as we speak. Birthrate decline is not universal. Mormons have a birth rate of 3.4. Amish and Orthodox Jews are at 6-7!
- dbspin 2y ago
  Citation needed, I don't think I've ever seen a historian make the argument that the determining factor in civilisational conflict was birth rates. Guns, germs, steel, and various other resources. Access to ruminants and horses, sure. But birth rates. That's a new one.

by dbspin 2y ago

This is no more likely than malthusian predictions of over population leading to mass starvation. It turns out that human populations self regulate when a basic level of needs are met.

alexey-salmin 2y ago

Yes, the self-regulation mechanism is that cultures that produce too many "problem with pronatalism" articles get regulated away.

smallmancontrov 2y ago

Agreed, but if we build an economy that maximizes extraction by artificially threatening basic needs, we could stay in the exponential decline for quite some time.

pfdietz 2y ago

The feedback mechanism used to be that societies with inadequate birth rates were conquered and replaced.

Attrecomet 2y ago
And now, thanks to increased control over the environment due to technology and science, there are new tools in our repository that our ancestors did not have, like actually sitting down and planning how to avoid an ecological collapse -- and waging war with advanced weapons that negate a pure "breed fast" strategy. It sure would be nice if we didn't have to return to regular periods of widespread starvation like they did back in the Middle Ages, when they were too uninformed to not remove all forests and powerless to avoid staying away from the carrying capacity of their world for any amount of time.
Muromec 2y ago
no need to conquer anybody — just fuck up the rest of the world and get net population increase through immigration from places where people don’t want to live
fallingknife 2y ago
Used to be? It's happening as we speak. Birthrate decline is not universal. Mormons have a birth rate of 3.4. Amish and Orthodox Jews are at 6-7!
dbspin 2y ago
Citation needed, I don't think I've ever seen a historian make the argument that the determining factor in civilisational conflict was birth rates. Guns, germs, steel, and various other resources. Access to ruminants and horses, sure. But birth rates. That's a new one.