4 ms·

> 1. ARM is inherently more efficient than x86 CPUs in most tasks I'm not sure how you're reaching the conclusion of "most tasks" when Cinebench R24 is the onl

> 1. ARM is inherently more efficient than x86 CPUs in most tasks I'm not sure how you're reaching the conclusion of "most tasks" when Cinebench R24 is the only test you used because R23, which doesn't agree, was rejected for hand-wavey nebulous reasons, and nothing else was tested. R24 is hardly a representative workload of "most tasks" nor is it claiming/trying to be.

hajile 2y ago
Anandtech shows[0] that M3 is massively ahead in integer performance, but slightly behind in float performance on Spec 2017. Integer workloads are by far the most common, but they tend to not scale to multiple cores very well. Most workloads that scale well across cores also benefit from big FP/SIMD units too. Put another way, the real issue with R24 is that it makes HX370 look better than it would look in more normal consumer workloads. [0] https://www.anandtech.com/show/21485/the-amd-ryzen-ai-hx-370-review/4 https://www.anandtech.com/show/21485/the-amd-ryzen-ai-hx-370...
- kllrnohj 2y ago
  > that M3 is massively ahead in integer performance The M3 is certainly an impressive chip, but note that it's only massively ahead in some of the int tests. It's not a consistent gap. > Integer workloads are by far the most common, but they tend to not scale to multiple cores very well. The HX370 does better than the Me in specint MT though. But regardless the anandtech results paint a much closer picture than the single R24 results that GP used as the basis of the efficiency thesis.
  - aurareturn 2y ago
    The HX370 should win in SPECINT MT. It has 12 cores to the M3's 8 cores and it runs at significantly higher power. Compare HX370 SPECINT MT To an M3 Pro and let's see the results.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
    - kllrnohj 2y ago
      > [HX370] runs at significantly higher power. It used 33w. Meanwhile the M3 result came from a 2023 MacBook Pro 14-Inch, which certainly has the potential for a TDP of around that. If you can find SPECINT MT numbers w/ power data for an M3 Pro lets see it. Or even just power data for an M3 non-pro in the 14" MBP. A quick search isn't turning up any.
      - aurareturn 2y ago
        M3's CPU uses around ~10w while running ST tasks. The ~30w TDP of an M3 Pro is if it's running CPU and GPU tasks at max load.
aurareturn 2y ago
>I'm not sure how you're reaching the conclusion of "most tasks" when Cinebench R24 is the only test you used because R23, which doesn't agree, was rejected for hand-wavey nebulous reasons, and nothing else was tested. There are no hand-wavey nebulous reasons. Cinebench R23 uses Intel Embree engine, which is hand optimized for x86 CPUs. That's why x86 CPUs look far better than ARM CPUs in it. If there is an application that is purely hand optimized for ARM, and then compiled for x86, do you think it's fair to use it to compare the two architectures? SPEC & GB6 mostly agrees with Cinebench 2024.

hajile 2y ago

Anandtech shows[0] that M3 is massively ahead in integer performance, but slightly behind in float performance on Spec 2017. Integer workloads are by far the most common, but they tend to not scale to multiple cores very well. Most workloads that scale well across cores also benefit from big FP/SIMD units too. Put another way, the real issue with R24 is that it makes HX370 look better than it would look in more normal consumer workloads. [0] https://www.anandtech.com/show/21485/the-amd-ryzen-ai-hx-370-review/4 https://www.anandtech.com/show/21485/the-amd-ryzen-ai-hx-370...

kllrnohj 2y ago
> that M3 is massively ahead in integer performance The M3 is certainly an impressive chip, but note that it's only massively ahead in some of the int tests. It's not a consistent gap. > Integer workloads are by far the most common, but they tend to not scale to multiple cores very well. The HX370 does better than the Me in specint MT though. But regardless the anandtech results paint a much closer picture than the single R24 results that GP used as the basis of the efficiency thesis.
- aurareturn 2y ago
  The HX370 should win in SPECINT MT. It has 12 cores to the M3's 8 cores and it runs at significantly higher power. Compare HX370 SPECINT MT To an M3 Pro and let's see the results.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - kllrnohj 2y ago
    > [HX370] runs at significantly higher power. It used 33w. Meanwhile the M3 result came from a 2023 MacBook Pro 14-Inch, which certainly has the potential for a TDP of around that. If you can find SPECINT MT numbers w/ power data for an M3 Pro lets see it. Or even just power data for an M3 non-pro in the 14" MBP. A quick search isn't turning up any.
    - aurareturn 2y ago
      M3's CPU uses around ~10w while running ST tasks. The ~30w TDP of an M3 Pro is if it's running CPU and GPU tasks at max load.

aurareturn 2y ago

>I'm not sure how you're reaching the conclusion of "most tasks" when Cinebench R24 is the only test you used because R23, which doesn't agree, was rejected for hand-wavey nebulous reasons, and nothing else was tested. There are no hand-wavey nebulous reasons. Cinebench R23 uses Intel Embree engine, which is hand optimized for x86 CPUs. That's why x86 CPUs look far better than ARM CPUs in it. If there is an application that is purely hand optimized for ARM, and then compiled for x86, do you think it's fair to use it to compare the two architectures? SPEC & GB6 mostly agrees with Cinebench 2024.