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I’m a software engineer, with a degree, and SWE does have the same ethical principles and the same engineering process, from problem definition and requirements

I’m a software engineer, with a degree, and SWE does have the same ethical principles and the same engineering process, from problem definition and requirements a the way to development lifecycle, testing, deployment indigent management, etc. none of it includes sprints and story points. Suffice it to say most SWEs are not being hired to do actual engineering, bc the industry can’t get over the fact that just because you can update and release SW instantly doesn’t mean you should.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> SWE does have the same ethical principles and the same engineering process The lack of certification means this training isn’t reinforced to the degree it is in engineering.
- WarOnPrivacy 2y ago
  Right. If the coding industry mimics the construction industry, we wind up with one position called engineer that assumes most of the liability. The other 99.99....% of software engineers will get different titles. All of this ignores the individuals who are most responsible for these catastrophes. Investors and executives deliver relentless and effective pressure toward practices that maximize their profits - at the expense of all else. They purposefully create + nurture a single point of failure and are massively rewarded for the harm that causes (while the consequences are suffered by everyone else). Thanks to the pass they reliably get, we get their leadership design degrading every industry it can.
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    > If the coding industry mimics the construction industry, we wind up with one position called engineer that assumes most of the liability If their sign off is required, this could work. The question is whether it’s worth it, and if it is, in which contexts.
    - WarOnPrivacy 2y ago
      > If their sign off is required, this could work. The question is whether it’s worth it, and if it is, in which contexts. Civil engineers liability is tied to standards set by gov agencies/depts and industry consortium. Standards would have to be created in software engineering - along with the associated gov & industry bodies. In civil engineering, those things grew during/from many decades of need.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago

> SWE does have the same ethical principles and the same engineering process The lack of certification means this training isn’t reinforced to the degree it is in engineering.

WarOnPrivacy 2y ago
Right. If the coding industry mimics the construction industry, we wind up with one position called engineer that assumes most of the liability. The other 99.99....% of software engineers will get different titles. All of this ignores the individuals who are most responsible for these catastrophes. Investors and executives deliver relentless and effective pressure toward practices that maximize their profits - at the expense of all else. They purposefully create + nurture a single point of failure and are massively rewarded for the harm that causes (while the consequences are suffered by everyone else). Thanks to the pass they reliably get, we get their leadership design degrading every industry it can.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > If the coding industry mimics the construction industry, we wind up with one position called engineer that assumes most of the liability If their sign off is required, this could work. The question is whether it’s worth it, and if it is, in which contexts.
  - WarOnPrivacy 2y ago
    > If their sign off is required, this could work. The question is whether it’s worth it, and if it is, in which contexts. Civil engineers liability is tied to standards set by gov agencies/depts and industry consortium. Standards would have to be created in software engineering - along with the associated gov & industry bodies. In civil engineering, those things grew during/from many decades of need.