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People with disabilities, or elderly people, need straws. https://cdrnys.org/blog/disability-dialogue/grasping-at-straws-the-ableism-of-the-straw-ban/ https://

People with disabilities, or elderly people, need straws. https://cdrnys.org/blog/disability-dialogue/grasping-at-straws-the-ableism-of-the-straw-ban/ https://cdrnys.org/blog/disability-dialogue/grasping-at-stra...

quasse 2y ago
I'm not an anti-straw crusader but I think this is a bit of a bad faith argument. People with various disabilities or age related also frequently require lots of other assistive devices but that doesn't imply that they need to be used as the default for every single consumer. My grocery store doesn't hand every shopper a wheelchair instead of a shopping cart just because some percentage of the population requires them.
- TylerE 2y ago
  Most groceries stores DO offer wheelchairs, either powered or manual, to their customers.
  - recursive 2y ago
    > doesn't hand every shopper a wheelchair > DO offer wheelchairs You see the difference, right? We can do that for straws.
  - ryandrake 2y ago
    But they are not the default, and that's OP and OOOP's point. There's no reason 99% of the population needs to be served their drinks with a straw. Straws should be available for the 1% who need them for accessibility reasons and some (probably very small) group who prefer to use them for whatever reason. But they should not be the default.
- HWR_14 2y ago
  > My grocery store doesn't hand every shopper a wheelchair instead of a shopping cart just because some percentage of the population requires them. Strange choice of example. Electric wheelchairs are available at most stores of a certain size. Wheelchair reserved parking is available at all almost all stores. (in California)
  - quasse 2y ago
    I still don't think you're following what I'm saying. When you go to the grocery store, what is the DEFAULT option available to you? Is there a corral of hundreds of wheelchairs with one waiting for every shopper? Just because something should be available does not mean it should be the default.
sleepybrett 2y ago
A more robust reusable plastic straw would be more acceptable than single use disposable plastic straws for people who require them. IMO paper, wax coated or not, is acceptable for a disposable scenario. There are also your steel/aluminum/titanium, glass alternatives, I find those potentially dangerous (i don't want to stab the roof of my mouth or crack my teeth against a metal straw and i don't want a glass straw breaking off in my mouth). Perhaps someone else will come up with an even better alternative (a stiff silicone?) I don't think anyone is saying that we should ban 100% of all straws which are made of plastics, they are more concerned with decreasing the amount of 'single-use disposable' straws made of plastics.

quasse 2y ago

I'm not an anti-straw crusader but I think this is a bit of a bad faith argument. People with various disabilities or age related also frequently require lots of other assistive devices but that doesn't imply that they need to be used as the default for every single consumer. My grocery store doesn't hand every shopper a wheelchair instead of a shopping cart just because some percentage of the population requires them.

TylerE 2y ago
Most groceries stores DO offer wheelchairs, either powered or manual, to their customers.
- recursive 2y ago
  > doesn't hand every shopper a wheelchair > DO offer wheelchairs You see the difference, right? We can do that for straws.
- ryandrake 2y ago
  But they are not the default, and that's OP and OOOP's point. There's no reason 99% of the population needs to be served their drinks with a straw. Straws should be available for the 1% who need them for accessibility reasons and some (probably very small) group who prefer to use them for whatever reason. But they should not be the default.
HWR_14 2y ago
> My grocery store doesn't hand every shopper a wheelchair instead of a shopping cart just because some percentage of the population requires them. Strange choice of example. Electric wheelchairs are available at most stores of a certain size. Wheelchair reserved parking is available at all almost all stores. (in California)
- quasse 2y ago
  I still don't think you're following what I'm saying. When you go to the grocery store, what is the DEFAULT option available to you? Is there a corral of hundreds of wheelchairs with one waiting for every shopper? Just because something should be available does not mean it should be the default.

sleepybrett 2y ago

A more robust reusable plastic straw would be more acceptable than single use disposable plastic straws for people who require them. IMO paper, wax coated or not, is acceptable for a disposable scenario. There are also your steel/aluminum/titanium, glass alternatives, I find those potentially dangerous (i don't want to stab the roof of my mouth or crack my teeth against a metal straw and i don't want a glass straw breaking off in my mouth). Perhaps someone else will come up with an even better alternative (a stiff silicone?) I don't think anyone is saying that we should ban 100% of all straws which are made of plastics, they are more concerned with decreasing the amount of 'single-use disposable' straws made of plastics.