4 ms·

is this specific to DB only? I feel like Germany needs a lot of workforce at German quality but no way they can fill that with any type of foreign immigration.

is this specific to DB only? I feel like Germany needs a lot of workforce at German quality but no way they can fill that with any type of foreign immigration. They lowered a lot of immigration requirements to entry because of this. But still it will be not enough. It's a cultural thing and low wages in Germany can't fix it.

Gare 2y ago
And now because of German needs eastern and south-easthern EU countries are in even worse position because Germany has hoovered up a decent chunk of skilled younger workforce. We have started to import unskilled/low skilled laborers from SE Asia en masse to keep the country barely running. But the quality is going downhill yet prices of goods and real estate are soaring.
- Rinzler89 2y ago
  >and south-easthern EU countries are in even worse position The economy of Easter Europe has been growing steadily in the last years and skilled immigration tom Germany ahs slowed since the salary/CoL ratio has reduced lately.
trueismywork 2y ago
The language is a big problem. They can get quality immigrants, but convincing those quality immigrants to learn German is a big task. A lot of people would rather go to US with all it's uncertainty than stay in Germany due to these issues.
- Rinzler89 2y ago
  The language isn't the biggest problem. Once you learn the language your problems don't stop. The big problem is most companies in Germany still prefer to exclusively hire locals who went through the German education system and have degrees from established local educational institutions, instead of recognizing foreigners' digress from abroad at similar levels to that of locals. It's a white collar form of discrimination. Unless you come from a country as 'white' and wealthy as Germany, your degrees and experience is seen as much less valuable despite your language knowledge and your CV will be rejected even if it's technically a fit. Then comes the discrimination you'll face when looking for a place to rent but that's in other countries as well like the Netherlands.
  - trueismywork 2y ago
    Fair enough..
  - pyuser583 2y ago
    Americans don’t place much trust in foreign degrees. We do value actual experience (as opposed to certification). I once interviewed a nanny who had been a practicing lawyer in Central America. I chose to hire someone with no education, but an extra year of nannying.
ivan_gammel 2y ago
Well, we just got one million of Ukrainian refugees, half of which is not going to return home according to dome polls, but you are right, the demographics cannot be fixed by immigration alone. I myself currently work on a corporate healthcare project with the goal to reduce sick leaves and reduce health-related early retirements. The parental benefits in Germany are quite generous, but it all breaks into the growing cost of living wall. Everyone understands what’s going on and the urgency, but real solutions are yet to be found.
- Rinzler89 2y ago
  > but real solutions are yet to be found "Real solutions" exist, but voters won't want to hear them, so we kick the can down the road until the system collapses by itself naturally.
  - ivan_gammel 2y ago
    They are non-solutions if they cannot pass voter approval. But what are you talking about exactly?
    - Rinzler89 2y ago
      >They are non-solutions if they cannot pass voter approval. Then why don't voters just vote themselves higher salaries and better pension plans and higher retirement ages? D'uh! Who cares about economics when you have votes? Worked well for Greece. >But what are you talking about exactly? Reducing public welfare according to realistic economic capacity and sustainability of the national budget, and encourage citizens to rely more on private systems and personal responsibility. See Switzerland.
      - xg15 2y ago
        You're aware that the Swiss railway is nationalized? Since 1901... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_Federal_Railways https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_Federal_Railways
sunaookami 2y ago
>low wages in Germany Don't forget the absurdly high social expenditures and taxes. You only keep like 40% of your money and it's on track to get even worse.
- user90131313 2y ago
  Yes with no real retirement in the future :) All social benefits and retirements will collapse and %100 not sustainable not only for Germany but for so many nations. Many reason exist already and it just takes longer.
- ivan_gammel 2y ago
  German welfare state is worth paying it, it just needs to become more efficient. I don’t miss lower taxes I enjoyed in other countries, because I see the difference. And, anyway, high taxes hit upper middle class the most, for majority of population it’s not the biggest concern — rent is.

Gare 2y ago

And now because of German needs eastern and south-easthern EU countries are in even worse position because Germany has hoovered up a decent chunk of skilled younger workforce. We have started to import unskilled/low skilled laborers from SE Asia en masse to keep the country barely running. But the quality is going downhill yet prices of goods and real estate are soaring.

Rinzler89 2y ago
>and south-easthern EU countries are in even worse position The economy of Easter Europe has been growing steadily in the last years and skilled immigration tom Germany ahs slowed since the salary/CoL ratio has reduced lately.

trueismywork 2y ago

The language is a big problem. They can get quality immigrants, but convincing those quality immigrants to learn German is a big task. A lot of people would rather go to US with all it's uncertainty than stay in Germany due to these issues.

Rinzler89 2y ago
The language isn't the biggest problem. Once you learn the language your problems don't stop. The big problem is most companies in Germany still prefer to exclusively hire locals who went through the German education system and have degrees from established local educational institutions, instead of recognizing foreigners' digress from abroad at similar levels to that of locals. It's a white collar form of discrimination. Unless you come from a country as 'white' and wealthy as Germany, your degrees and experience is seen as much less valuable despite your language knowledge and your CV will be rejected even if it's technically a fit. Then comes the discrimination you'll face when looking for a place to rent but that's in other countries as well like the Netherlands.
- trueismywork 2y ago
  Fair enough..
- pyuser583 2y ago
  Americans don’t place much trust in foreign degrees. We do value actual experience (as opposed to certification). I once interviewed a nanny who had been a practicing lawyer in Central America. I chose to hire someone with no education, but an extra year of nannying.

ivan_gammel 2y ago

Well, we just got one million of Ukrainian refugees, half of which is not going to return home according to dome polls, but you are right, the demographics cannot be fixed by immigration alone. I myself currently work on a corporate healthcare project with the goal to reduce sick leaves and reduce health-related early retirements. The parental benefits in Germany are quite generous, but it all breaks into the growing cost of living wall. Everyone understands what’s going on and the urgency, but real solutions are yet to be found.

Rinzler89 2y ago
> but real solutions are yet to be found "Real solutions" exist, but voters won't want to hear them, so we kick the can down the road until the system collapses by itself naturally.
- ivan_gammel 2y ago
  They are non-solutions if they cannot pass voter approval. But what are you talking about exactly?
  - Rinzler89 2y ago
    >They are non-solutions if they cannot pass voter approval. Then why don't voters just vote themselves higher salaries and better pension plans and higher retirement ages? D'uh! Who cares about economics when you have votes? Worked well for Greece. >But what are you talking about exactly? Reducing public welfare according to realistic economic capacity and sustainability of the national budget, and encourage citizens to rely more on private systems and personal responsibility. See Switzerland.
    - xg15 2y ago
      You're aware that the Swiss railway is nationalized? Since 1901... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_Federal_Railways https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_Federal_Railways

sunaookami 2y ago

>low wages in Germany Don't forget the absurdly high social expenditures and taxes. You only keep like 40% of your money and it's on track to get even worse.

user90131313 2y ago
Yes with no real retirement in the future :) All social benefits and retirements will collapse and %100 not sustainable not only for Germany but for so many nations. Many reason exist already and it just takes longer.
ivan_gammel 2y ago
German welfare state is worth paying it, it just needs to become more efficient. I don’t miss lower taxes I enjoyed in other countries, because I see the difference. And, anyway, high taxes hit upper middle class the most, for majority of population it’s not the biggest concern — rent is.