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> I am looking at you Jira! Jira is like Java, many people think of their experience in 2000-2010s in some ugly corporate environment, not being aware how good

> I am looking at you Jira! Jira is like Java, many people think of their experience in 2000-2010s in some ugly corporate environment, not being aware how good it can be in agile environment where people are really above the processes.

gosub100 2y ago
I can't wait for the first post showing Jira to be turning complete. Followed by the first Fizz Buzz written in Jira.
- yieldcrv 2y ago
  Probably can with those awful workflows
  - j45 2y ago
    Haha, that's funny and might even be true. I once went looking into "how did this ever become to be". The underlying workflow system in JIRA is based unsurprisingly on an existing workflow management library. And so much made sense about 'why' is it this way. It also reminded me why most JIRA "replacements" only replace whatever the origin story of the creator of the software is, where they're at, what their priorities are, and how to get there.
asdfman123 2y ago
The problem isn't the processes, the problem is the people. The good news is that in a good environment, you can earn trust after a few years and gain a little more freedom. You are basically then solving the "people" problem by fixing the only person you have control over: yourself. (Of course, I understand not everyone is working in healthy environments. Some micromanagers will never be satisfied!)
- ivan_gammel 2y ago
  Healthy environment is not the one where you need to gain trust to get more freedom, it’s where you are free from the beginning and follow (and develop) best practices instead of obeying the rules. It is a combination of trust by default and safety net, where mistakes are made, but they don’t kill the business and are corrected quickly.
j45 2y ago
Most people use JIRA out of the box and have a bad experience. I know I did for 10 years. Then I had to soak up a slightly complex workflow or two, and I realized most people don't actually use JIRA or set it up and collect lots of trauma.

gosub100 2y ago

I can't wait for the first post showing Jira to be turning complete. Followed by the first Fizz Buzz written in Jira.

yieldcrv 2y ago
Probably can with those awful workflows
- j45 2y ago
  Haha, that's funny and might even be true. I once went looking into "how did this ever become to be". The underlying workflow system in JIRA is based unsurprisingly on an existing workflow management library. And so much made sense about 'why' is it this way. It also reminded me why most JIRA "replacements" only replace whatever the origin story of the creator of the software is, where they're at, what their priorities are, and how to get there.

asdfman123 2y ago

The problem isn't the processes, the problem is the people. The good news is that in a good environment, you can earn trust after a few years and gain a little more freedom. You are basically then solving the "people" problem by fixing the only person you have control over: yourself. (Of course, I understand not everyone is working in healthy environments. Some micromanagers will never be satisfied!)

ivan_gammel 2y ago
Healthy environment is not the one where you need to gain trust to get more freedom, it’s where you are free from the beginning and follow (and develop) best practices instead of obeying the rules. It is a combination of trust by default and safety net, where mistakes are made, but they don’t kill the business and are corrected quickly.

j45 2y ago

Most people use JIRA out of the box and have a bad experience. I know I did for 10 years. Then I had to soak up a slightly complex workflow or two, and I realized most people don't actually use JIRA or set it up and collect lots of trauma.