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Ok but first you said "no one cares", I responded to that showing you that a medium-sized group of users or privacy-aware types care, now you change it to "most

by smcin 2y ago

Ok but first you said "no one cares", I responded to that showing you that a medium-sized group of users or privacy-aware types care, now you change it to "most people who are not on HN do not care/cannot afford to care". Sure the latter is true but that wasn't what you first said. Also it's not true in the EU. And it's not "haranguing": the set of people who care about the implications of the intrusive ToS doesn't need to be the set of end-users, although yes it would impact McDonald's business practices more directly if those overlapped more. The general public (in the US) may eventually connect data breaches to the lack of meaningful privacy legislation to the heavy lobbying to the permissive attitude between tech, regulators, politicians, data brokers and the finance industry. If the Snowflake and Okta breaches plus the huge impact of the Crowdstrike-related outage aren't instrumental in forcing some minimal standard in vendor liability, then there will eventually be even bigger and worse outages until someday that happens. Yes it's weirdly depressing to watch Congress's hate sessions against TikTok contrast with the utter silence on IT vendors' nonstop breaches. But also the 2024 election, deepfakes and GenAI are going to be big in the next three months, and might be pivotal to the election outcome, and cause a backlash comparable to or bigger than 2016. The TikTok US divestment deadline is Jan 19, 2025, which means Congress put TikTok (but not its competitors) on probation until after the election. It also looks likely Twitter/X will be strongly involved in election-related persuasion campaigns. As to Meta, Apple has gone to war with Meta in making privacy a key selling point for iPhone. So some fraction of Meta's market valuation has been conceptually transferred to Apple's valuation. So yes your take on the average McDonald's app user is correct, but I think the wider 2024 outlook on digital privacy is changing; we can't know how much till after the election. Remember after the 2016 election, people didn't figure out how exactly tech had influenced the outcome until March 2017. And there's more at stake in 2024.

satvikpendem 2y ago
The phrase "no one cares" never literally means that not one person cares. It refers to the demographic one is talking about, ie McDonald's app users, which is what I clarified in my earlier comment due to then predicting precisely this sort of argument taking place, which of course it did. > If the Snowflake and Okta breaches plus the huge impact of the Crowdstrike-related outage aren't instrumental in forcing some minimal standard in vendor liability, then there will eventually be even bigger and worse outages until someday that happens. [...] But also the 2024 election, deepfakes and GenAI are going to be big in the next three months, and might be pivotal to the election outcome, and cause a backlash comparable to or bigger than 2016. [...] As to Meta, Apple has gone to war with Meta in making privacy a key selling point for iPhone. So some fraction of Meta's market valuation has been conceptually transferred to Apple's valuation. You have more faith than I. Every single time people on HN or in the wider tech community think the general public cares about privacy (not necessarily the governments, which, while some do, most still do not), the general public show themselves time and again to not care. It is seemingly simply something immutable, because convenience is easier (by definition) than inconvenience, which is what privacy advocates impose on the public. And also, Meta's stocks are higher than ever, as said earlier, and they have largely worked around any of Apple's privacy blocks, so it cannot be said that their valuation has transferred in any part to Apple.

by smcin 2y ago

satvikpendem 2y ago

The phrase "no one cares" never literally means that not one person cares. It refers to the demographic one is talking about, ie McDonald's app users, which is what I clarified in my earlier comment due to then predicting precisely this sort of argument taking place, which of course it did. > If the Snowflake and Okta breaches plus the huge impact of the Crowdstrike-related outage aren't instrumental in forcing some minimal standard in vendor liability, then there will eventually be even bigger and worse outages until someday that happens. [...] But also the 2024 election, deepfakes and GenAI are going to be big in the next three months, and might be pivotal to the election outcome, and cause a backlash comparable to or bigger than 2016. [...] As to Meta, Apple has gone to war with Meta in making privacy a key selling point for iPhone. So some fraction of Meta's market valuation has been conceptually transferred to Apple's valuation. You have more faith than I. Every single time people on HN or in the wider tech community think the general public cares about privacy (not necessarily the governments, which, while some do, most still do not), the general public show themselves time and again to not care. It is seemingly simply something immutable, because convenience is easier (by definition) than inconvenience, which is what privacy advocates impose on the public. And also, Meta's stocks are higher than ever, as said earlier, and they have largely worked around any of Apple's privacy blocks, so it cannot be said that their valuation has transferred in any part to Apple.