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Put another way, everyone in Germany except the rich are forced to pay for a full-price family plan that includes coverage for spouse and kids, and do not even

Put another way, everyone in Germany except the rich are forced to pay for a full-price family plan that includes coverage for spouse and kids, and do not even have the option to instead opt for a much cheaper individual plan that only covers themself? That sounds like single people are indirectly subsidizing the healthcare of families by paying full price without reaping the full benefits. This sounds less fair to me than the American system where an individual can opt to pay much less in exchange for coverage only for themself. Unless I am misunderstanding and such an option does exist in Germany?

mschuster91 2y ago
> Put another way, everyone in Germany except the rich are forced to pay for a full-price family plan that includes coverage for spouse and kids, and do not even have the option to instead opt for a much cheaper individual plan that only covers themself? Well, the rich have to pay far more expensive private-insurance plans, and the 88% on the government insurance scheme pay a fixed share of their wages (~15%). Each according to their ability, and everyone is paying in solidarity with everyone else. Those on unemployment benefits have their contributions paid for by the unemployment insurance (which is also mandatory and a percentage of your wages). > That sounds like single people are indirectly subsidizing the healthcare of families by paying full price without reaping the full benefits. This sounds less fair to me than the American system where an individual can opt to pay much less in exchange for coverage only for themself. Well, the American system may sound "fairer" on paper, but has massive downsides for society at large - it disincentivises people from having children, tying healthcare to employment leads people being trapped in toxic workplace environments, and stuff like "out of pocket thresholds" is a massive issue for low-income earners, particularly those with chronic illnesses like diabetes. And: Something like diabetics stretching their insulin or people in obvious need of an ambulance telling bystanders to not call an ambulance because they can't afford it is completely unheard of here. In fact, we consider such reports to be unworthy of a "developed nation".
- anonym29 2y ago
  I want to point out that low income earners in the states pay far less out of pocket than the middle class - the expenses of the poor are covered by Medicaid, and that's just the tip of the spear in terms of the sheer number of social assistance programs the US provisions to those experiencing poverty.
  - mschuster91 2y ago
    Yeah but everyone slightly above the Medicaid threshold ends up getting fucked, and that can't be the answer either. No developed nation other than the US has "medical bankruptcy" as a routinely used term. That tells everything.

mschuster91 2y ago

> Put another way, everyone in Germany except the rich are forced to pay for a full-price family plan that includes coverage for spouse and kids, and do not even have the option to instead opt for a much cheaper individual plan that only covers themself? Well, the rich have to pay far more expensive private-insurance plans, and the 88% on the government insurance scheme pay a fixed share of their wages (~15%). Each according to their ability, and everyone is paying in solidarity with everyone else. Those on unemployment benefits have their contributions paid for by the unemployment insurance (which is also mandatory and a percentage of your wages). > That sounds like single people are indirectly subsidizing the healthcare of families by paying full price without reaping the full benefits. This sounds less fair to me than the American system where an individual can opt to pay much less in exchange for coverage only for themself. Well, the American system may sound "fairer" on paper, but has massive downsides for society at large - it disincentivises people from having children, tying healthcare to employment leads people being trapped in toxic workplace environments, and stuff like "out of pocket thresholds" is a massive issue for low-income earners, particularly those with chronic illnesses like diabetes. And: Something like diabetics stretching their insulin or people in obvious need of an ambulance telling bystanders to not call an ambulance because they can't afford it is completely unheard of here. In fact, we consider such reports to be unworthy of a "developed nation".

anonym29 2y ago
I want to point out that low income earners in the states pay far less out of pocket than the middle class - the expenses of the poor are covered by Medicaid, and that's just the tip of the spear in terms of the sheer number of social assistance programs the US provisions to those experiencing poverty.
- mschuster91 2y ago
  Yeah but everyone slightly above the Medicaid threshold ends up getting fucked, and that can't be the answer either. No developed nation other than the US has "medical bankruptcy" as a routinely used term. That tells everything.