15 ms·

Newegg Still Telling Customers That Installing New OS Violates Return Policy

171 points by mayneack 14y ago

xxiao 14y ago
While I love Linux and use it for both work and home. I'm for Newegg. A policy is a policy and not all customers are skillful enough to reload a different OS. I don't think any Linux vendors(Dell, System76,etc) will happily accept returns after you installed Windows on it. The best could be that we can buy machines with Linux pre-loaded, or certain distro certified. For instance, we choose a PC/laptop, and it's certified with Windows7 and Ubuntu 12.04 both, then you're safe to choose either, otherwise you're on your own. Not to mention Newegg is just a market place instead of the vendor.
- RossDM 14y ago
  I see what you're saying, but how far do we take this? If I upgrade to Mountain Lion in July, am I no longer covered? Dual-boot to Windows? Seems ripe for abusing.
  - zschallz 14y ago
    To be fair, the return policy only lasts for about 14-30 days; then the manufacturer will have to service it.
    - rmc 14y ago
      Depends on local laws. In some places (EU) the retailer is on the hook for 2 years.
- rickdale 14y ago
  I agree, but Newegg didn't stand strong when the first case got some attention. They should have remained strong and just enforced the policy knowing that in 3-4 weeks most people would have forgot about the instance any ways. It now becomes one of those cases where if you are trying to return the laptop you are just pissed off because you feel like they aren't doing everything that they can. It's a catch-22 in a way. You just got to be consistent.
- padraigm 14y ago
  That's nonsense. First of all, there's basically no way that botching an OS install should be able to damage hardware, and for anything other than a hard drive problem the vast majority of retailers will accept returns with the drive removed (for privacy purposes). Even more importantly, though, the written Newegg policy allows customers to install a different OS without voiding the warranty; the problem is that Newegg is apparently doing a very bad job at educating their CSR's of what their policies actually are.
- EthanHeilman 14y ago
  > I'm for Newegg. A policy is a policy That would be reasonable if newegg listed an OS change as a reason for invalidating a warranty. The problem is their policy and public statements say it is completely ok, but privately they say it is not. Newegg has stated that: 1. only modifications to the hardware invalidate the warranty 2: and newegg has specifically gone on the record to state that installing linux does not invalidate the warranty.
- rmc 14y ago
  The best could be that we can buy machines with Linux pre-loaded, or certain distro certified. That would be best. However large incumbant OS retailers occasionally engage in illegal, anti-trust acts to prevent this happening.
- antihero 14y ago
  If hardware fails and it is nothing to do with software (99.999999% of the time), it should be replaced under warranty. Full stop. Perhaps they should give an option for your warranty to either include both hardware and software, or JUST include hardware, and so they will ignore any software changes (but also not, for instance, fix your Windows partition)
- jcdrepair 14y ago
  I don't see how you can stand with Newegg on this unless you think that it's just installing Linux that should void the warranty. I have plenty of friends that hate all the crapware that comes pre-installed on a computer and the first thing they do is re-install Windows. Does that void the return policy terms? I have other friends that hate the latest version of Windows and are still hanging on to their XP install disks. Does that void the policy? How about if some just installs some brand new, virus filled software on to the existing computer? Does that void the return policy? The fact is, terms like: "...if the item system has been changed or modified, we are unable to honor you a return..." essentially means they can deny anyone a return who installs any software on a computer. Who doesn't install software on their computer within the first few hours of opening it up? Maybe my mom. But trust me, Newegg does not want my mom as a customer. She's a technology companies worst nightmare when it comes to support.
- jsight 14y ago
  If this were in their policy, I would sort of agree. A return policy is not a warranty, and therefore a policy that disallowed returns after a major OS modification could potentially be reasonable. The problem here is that Newegg is not stating this up front. I've never had an issue with a mfg warranty in a case like this (most recommend not including the HD with returns anyway). I'm still a little confused as to why the customer didn't approach the mfg first. > I don't think any Linux vendors(Dell, System76,etc) will happily accept returns after you installed Windows on it. Citation, please? I am not aware of any other vendor with this limitation.
- xxiao 14y ago
  while i don't really care, how does the scoring work here? if you don't follow the popular saying then you got negative points? some of you guys are just sick, not good for health.
jere 14y ago
>Dogboy99: Was this a special one-time exception because Newegg was getting bad press? >Newegg: [Yes] Hilarious. Is the left hand not talking to the right or what? From the consumerist's first followup: >Thanks, Newegg, and let's hope that no one has to get out the Internet pitchforks and torches to get your employees to follow their own policies from here out.
- mayneack 14y ago
  Although it's not the most efficient way to go about getting things done, the internet pitchforks appear to be fairly effective when it comes to business. Next on the agenda is politics.
rmc 14y ago
Slightly misleading, the reply from Newegg says: "Please be kindly advised that if the item system has been changed or modified, we are unable to honor you a return and you will need to contact the manufacturer for further assistance." It's hard to know if "the item system" refers to the OS or hardware…
- EthanHeilman 14y ago
  Newegg has gone on record and specifically stated that it only applies to the hardware.
  - deleted 14y ago
    [deleted]
  - Ralith 14y ago
    Then why did they make a reply like that to a question explicitly asking about software?
    - deleted 14y ago
      [deleted]
- kingnite 14y ago
  What do they mean modified? Updating an OS is modifying it. Adding more software is modifying it, reg gets changed. Turning it on and adding a password is modifying it.
maratd 14y ago
I'm sorry, but what exactly do you think happens when you return something to a retailer? They wave a magic wand and everything is peachy? Like most retailers, NewEgg has to resell the unit. Just because you think there's something wrong with it, doesn't mean there is something wrong with it. I ran my own consumer electronics retail business for 5 years and about 70% of returns have absolutely nothing wrong with them. NewEgg can't just throw the stuff away, they'd go out of business. They also can't just send the stuff to the manufacturer. The manufacturer doesn't care about your issues and if you return stock of which 70% is functional for warranty service, they will kick your ass. So you hire guys to test the equipment and return it to sell-able condition and sell it as an open-box return. Back to our little problem. You bought a laptop. Great! You install Linux on it. Fine! Is it really that much trouble to return it to the same condition when you send it back? NewEgg has to hire guys who sit there for hours installing Windows from the non-existent install disks (they don't include those anymore ... you gotta download them) so that they can recoup their losses? It would cost them more than the laptop is worth. If the laptop is truly defective, and you can't install the original operating system as a consequence, NewEgg has no quick means of determining what you did with the system ... and the manufacturer won't care either. So if you buy a laptop and decide to return it, return it to factory condition. It's the least you can do. Yes, tinkering with it probably violated some terms or some warranty. Do everybody a favor and keep it to yourself.
- tocomment 14y ago
  I think you're right. The problem is they need to update their policy to say you can't change the OS. On the other hand, If someone has logged into the machine at all the software has been changed and they can't simply resell it; it would seem they'd have to reinstall the OS regardless.
- debacle 14y ago
  This is the most inane thing I have ever heard. If you buy a laptop, you're not returning it because there's something wrong with the software. You're returning it because there's something wrong with the hardware. If you bought a phone with a defective battery, would you delete all of your contacts out of it and image the OS before you returned it? If you're asking consumers to do something to preserve your margins, go fuck yourself.
URSpider94 14y ago
The real issue for NewEgg is probably whether you've blown away the Windows restore partition. Without that, it's probably going to get rejected by their reverse logistics vendor. This shouldn't be the customers problem, but for them it would be as if a hotel guest took all the sheets off the bed every morning and soaked them in the bathtub - enough people do that, you're going to have to hire extra maids.
- lukeschlather 14y ago
  Have you ever re-imaged a machine? It's easier than operating an industrial washing machine. (No pesky health codes to worry about.) But they should be re-imaging everything as a rule, regardless. Otherwise you could use their returns system to distribute trojans.
- kabdib 14y ago
  I had a Lenovo system from Fry's that I couldn't install NT on. In the process of trying to get the install to work, I managed to wipe the restore partition. They wouldn't take it back. "How can we re-sell this?" "It's broken. You can't." "We can't put this back on the shelf without the restore partition." I called my credit card company in front of them and had the charges reversed. "Have fun, boys." I'm sure that some poor sucker got that machine, DOA, and returned it again, with the same hassle.
sequoia 14y ago
"Your display is broken? Oh, you installed cygwin? Sorry, you're on your own: we don't support cygwin" Mostly joking but how far fetched is it to speculate such a thing, given that they are denying display service due to OS install? bittorrent clients can be quite hard on HDDs, I've heard, furthermore illegal torrents are purportedly full of malware which could "damage your computer"; can they reject a defective HDD claim if you have uTorrent installed?
- sliverstorm 14y ago
  This used to happen with automobiles. It's called the Magnuson-Moss Act.
- smackfu 14y ago
  Heh, wasn't THAT long ago that setting up your CRT monitor for Linux involved a lot of scary stuff about using invalid frequencies that could cause damage.
  - dexen 14y ago
    Only relevant on exceptionally old and broken hardware. Any decent CRT or LCD provides http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EDID http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EDID which lists both standard and non-standard modelines and frequency range. X.org takes that into account, unless you override it by hand. Also, the display will shut itself down if driven over threshold. On the other hand, any software will happily let bad hardware kill itself, if not customized for particular hardware kink. I had a Linux apparently kill a 2.5'' HDD. Turns out OEM configured the drive to unload heads very often, probably to produce impressive power savings -_-' After about one or two years constantly power-on, the drive accumulated its rated number (~500'000) of unloads and died.
papsosouid 14y ago
And just yesterday the story here had tons of people insisting that this was no big deal, just a one time mistake, and that they should shut up and be happy. This is exactly why I didn't consider their initial reaction to be an acceptable resolution. They need to make it 100% clear that you can install whatever OS you want, and they need to make it 100% clear that they are going to train their staff to know their own policies.
- powertower 14y ago
  1. The original post had a couple of people who experienced Linux drivers throwing the thermal control systems of the laptop in a loop, and damaging it. 2. Was there anything wrong with the laptop (70% of returns work perfectly)? If not, and it is returned in a non-original condition, why the hell would Newegg (who's margins are 1%) accept it and take a loss on it. Again, Newegg makes 1 dollar for every $100 sold, this is the lowest margin in the industry, and is why their prices are cheap... They simply can't cover people burning out their laptops with bad drivers, or accept working laptops with a missing OS, that might or might not have been partially damaged. They also can't cover people buying a laptop simply to see if Linux runs on it, knowing they can just ship it back. They probably don't want that type of business.
  - papsosouid 14y ago
    1. If the laptop was damaged because of the user's actions, then that should be their reason for rejecting the RMA. Not "you installed an operating system". 2. If there was nothing wrong with the laptop, then that should be their reason for rejecting the RMA. Not "you installed an operating system". I don't understand why there is such an obsession with their margins. How does that matter to me as a consumer in any way? I am purchasing a product. I expect to be able to return it if it is defective. Period. I do not care why they lie and refuse to accept a return on defective product. I do not care how much or how little money they make. I care that they are an honest business I can trust. If you value doing business with companies based on how little money they make, you are welcome to choose to do business with companies by that criteria. Those of us with different criteria do not become objectively incorrect for using those other criteria for making our decisions.
kenrikm 14y ago
So Amazon it is then! Bye bye NewEgg.. The relationship was nice while it lasted.
- alan_cx 14y ago
  Yeah, my attitude too. You know, in "dumb punter" mode, I don't care what the small print says and what the fine arguments are. As a punter, if my machine brakes, I want it replaced or fixed, not a legal mumbo jumbo debate. When I buy a PC, I don't want to need a lawyer with me. Basically, it's too much thinking and grief for something so, so simple. Whatever the savings might be, it's simply not worth it.
- barik 14y ago
  It's a terribly confusing universe these days, and boycotts must depend on the position of the moon. Wasn't that long ago that people wanted to boycott Amazon for doing their silly one-click patent. Or their 1984 Kindle book deletion thing. I'd take a break from HN and go play Diablo III, but alas, I'm supposed to boycott that too because of the bnetd snafu. Instead, I maintain a much simpler lifestyle by ordering from whatever place gives me a reasonable price and good service, regardless of other people's experiences. Both Amazon and New Egg have offered me excellent service in the past, and I will continue to use both.
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
davidf18 14y ago
The original laptop in question was a Thinkpad. Thinkpads have restore disks. I always install my own OS and then use the restore disks to restore the system to its original purchased condition by using the restore disks. I think most brands work this way. With my Mac Air I have a Bootcamp dual boot with both OSX and Windows 7. One can restore Macs also to their original software installed status.
- ihsw 14y ago
  Although restore disks are great it might be prudent to buy an additional disk drive and store the stock one away until time comes for RMA or otherwise. This way the condition of the laptop cannot be so easily disputed.
lnanek2 14y ago
Normally I'd say it's difficult for the retailer to support enthusiast needs like this. It can just be too costly. For example, maybe their return inspection policy is to run some Windows test software or something and it would have to be rewritten to multi-platform, or all their inspectors would have to spend time learning how to and reinstalling Windows, etc.. Push them too hard and they will run away from Linux crying due to the higher costs for few sales, like some sellers of hardware with Linux out of the box have done, or competitors not footing the bill will beat them out. It is a very low margin business where just having the automatic conveyor belts to put bins near where the parts have to be picked off the shelves helps immensely. Newegg sells a ton of components to enthusiasts and small time computer shops upgrading and building their machines part by part, however. I think they'd be better off with a more lax policy regarding OS installs considering their customer base.
- Symmetry 14y ago
  I think most of us would be ok if they had a policy of not supporting Linux returns and they were up front about it. But if they don't support Linux returns but claim to potential customers that they do support them then, well, that's problematic.
- keithpeter 14y ago
  "For example, maybe their return inspection policy is to run some Windows test software or something and it would have to be rewritten to multi-platform, or all their inspectors would have to spend time learning how to and reinstalling Windows, etc.." Or just boot from another device?
- schiffern 14y ago
  >For example, maybe their return inspection policy is to run some Windows test software or something Why would anyone run that on the user's OS?? If the point is to test the hardware, wouldn't it make more sense to have a custom USB stick OS that automatically runs the appropriate diagnostics after booting? What's easier: 1) plug in USB stick, power on machine, move on, or 2) power on machine, wait for OS to load, plug in USB stick, install diagnostic software, start diagnostics, which may or may not reflect actual hardware problems since you don't have a known-good OS under you? RMAs typically don't troubleshoot software. Even Apple's hardware return people will only offer to wipe your drive and reinstall (you did back up before sending it in, didn't you?)
antidoh 14y ago
Linux voids your warranty. Huh. In a way I can see their point. You bought hardware, plus a licensed copy of Windows. You returned it without Windows. But really, what does it cost to just re-image the disk? They don't really just resell RMAs without going over them, do they?

171 points by mayneack 14y ago

xxiao 14y ago

While I love Linux and use it for both work and home. I'm for Newegg. A policy is a policy and not all customers are skillful enough to reload a different OS. I don't think any Linux vendors(Dell, System76,etc) will happily accept returns after you installed Windows on it. The best could be that we can buy machines with Linux pre-loaded, or certain distro certified. For instance, we choose a PC/laptop, and it's certified with Windows7 and Ubuntu 12.04 both, then you're safe to choose either, otherwise you're on your own. Not to mention Newegg is just a market place instead of the vendor.

RossDM 14y ago
I see what you're saying, but how far do we take this? If I upgrade to Mountain Lion in July, am I no longer covered? Dual-boot to Windows? Seems ripe for abusing.
- zschallz 14y ago
  To be fair, the return policy only lasts for about 14-30 days; then the manufacturer will have to service it.
  - rmc 14y ago
    Depends on local laws. In some places (EU) the retailer is on the hook for 2 years.
rickdale 14y ago
I agree, but Newegg didn't stand strong when the first case got some attention. They should have remained strong and just enforced the policy knowing that in 3-4 weeks most people would have forgot about the instance any ways. It now becomes one of those cases where if you are trying to return the laptop you are just pissed off because you feel like they aren't doing everything that they can. It's a catch-22 in a way. You just got to be consistent.
padraigm 14y ago
That's nonsense. First of all, there's basically no way that botching an OS install should be able to damage hardware, and for anything other than a hard drive problem the vast majority of retailers will accept returns with the drive removed (for privacy purposes). Even more importantly, though, the written Newegg policy allows customers to install a different OS without voiding the warranty; the problem is that Newegg is apparently doing a very bad job at educating their CSR's of what their policies actually are.
EthanHeilman 14y ago
> I'm for Newegg. A policy is a policy That would be reasonable if newegg listed an OS change as a reason for invalidating a warranty. The problem is their policy and public statements say it is completely ok, but privately they say it is not. Newegg has stated that: 1. only modifications to the hardware invalidate the warranty 2: and newegg has specifically gone on the record to state that installing linux does not invalidate the warranty.
rmc 14y ago
The best could be that we can buy machines with Linux pre-loaded, or certain distro certified. That would be best. However large incumbant OS retailers occasionally engage in illegal, anti-trust acts to prevent this happening.
antihero 14y ago
If hardware fails and it is nothing to do with software (99.999999% of the time), it should be replaced under warranty. Full stop. Perhaps they should give an option for your warranty to either include both hardware and software, or JUST include hardware, and so they will ignore any software changes (but also not, for instance, fix your Windows partition)
jcdrepair 14y ago
I don't see how you can stand with Newegg on this unless you think that it's just installing Linux that should void the warranty. I have plenty of friends that hate all the crapware that comes pre-installed on a computer and the first thing they do is re-install Windows. Does that void the return policy terms? I have other friends that hate the latest version of Windows and are still hanging on to their XP install disks. Does that void the policy? How about if some just installs some brand new, virus filled software on to the existing computer? Does that void the return policy? The fact is, terms like: "...if the item system has been changed or modified, we are unable to honor you a return..." essentially means they can deny anyone a return who installs any software on a computer. Who doesn't install software on their computer within the first few hours of opening it up? Maybe my mom. But trust me, Newegg does not want my mom as a customer. She's a technology companies worst nightmare when it comes to support.
jsight 14y ago
If this were in their policy, I would sort of agree. A return policy is not a warranty, and therefore a policy that disallowed returns after a major OS modification could potentially be reasonable. The problem here is that Newegg is not stating this up front. I've never had an issue with a mfg warranty in a case like this (most recommend not including the HD with returns anyway). I'm still a little confused as to why the customer didn't approach the mfg first. > I don't think any Linux vendors(Dell, System76,etc) will happily accept returns after you installed Windows on it. Citation, please? I am not aware of any other vendor with this limitation.
xxiao 14y ago
while i don't really care, how does the scoring work here? if you don't follow the popular saying then you got negative points? some of you guys are just sick, not good for health.

jere 14y ago

>Dogboy99: Was this a special one-time exception because Newegg was getting bad press? >Newegg: [Yes] Hilarious. Is the left hand not talking to the right or what? From the consumerist's first followup: >Thanks, Newegg, and let's hope that no one has to get out the Internet pitchforks and torches to get your employees to follow their own policies from here out.

mayneack 14y ago
Although it's not the most efficient way to go about getting things done, the internet pitchforks appear to be fairly effective when it comes to business. Next on the agenda is politics.

rmc 14y ago

Slightly misleading, the reply from Newegg says: "Please be kindly advised that if the item system has been changed or modified, we are unable to honor you a return and you will need to contact the manufacturer for further assistance." It's hard to know if "the item system" refers to the OS or hardware…

EthanHeilman 14y ago
Newegg has gone on record and specifically stated that it only applies to the hardware.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- Ralith 14y ago
  Then why did they make a reply like that to a question explicitly asking about software?
  - deleted 14y ago
    [deleted]
kingnite 14y ago
What do they mean modified? Updating an OS is modifying it. Adding more software is modifying it, reg gets changed. Turning it on and adding a password is modifying it.

maratd 14y ago

I'm sorry, but what exactly do you think happens when you return something to a retailer? They wave a magic wand and everything is peachy? Like most retailers, NewEgg has to resell the unit. Just because you think there's something wrong with it, doesn't mean there is something wrong with it. I ran my own consumer electronics retail business for 5 years and about 70% of returns have absolutely nothing wrong with them. NewEgg can't just throw the stuff away, they'd go out of business. They also can't just send the stuff to the manufacturer. The manufacturer doesn't care about your issues and if you return stock of which 70% is functional for warranty service, they will kick your ass. So you hire guys to test the equipment and return it to sell-able condition and sell it as an open-box return. Back to our little problem. You bought a laptop. Great! You install Linux on it. Fine! Is it really that much trouble to return it to the same condition when you send it back? NewEgg has to hire guys who sit there for hours installing Windows from the non-existent install disks (they don't include those anymore ... you gotta download them) so that they can recoup their losses? It would cost them more than the laptop is worth. If the laptop is truly defective, and you can't install the original operating system as a consequence, NewEgg has no quick means of determining what you did with the system ... and the manufacturer won't care either. So if you buy a laptop and decide to return it, return it to factory condition. It's the least you can do. Yes, tinkering with it probably violated some terms or some warranty. Do everybody a favor and keep it to yourself.

tocomment 14y ago
I think you're right. The problem is they need to update their policy to say you can't change the OS. On the other hand, If someone has logged into the machine at all the software has been changed and they can't simply resell it; it would seem they'd have to reinstall the OS regardless.
debacle 14y ago
This is the most inane thing I have ever heard. If you buy a laptop, you're not returning it because there's something wrong with the software. You're returning it because there's something wrong with the hardware. If you bought a phone with a defective battery, would you delete all of your contacts out of it and image the OS before you returned it? If you're asking consumers to do something to preserve your margins, go fuck yourself.

URSpider94 14y ago

The real issue for NewEgg is probably whether you've blown away the Windows restore partition. Without that, it's probably going to get rejected by their reverse logistics vendor. This shouldn't be the customers problem, but for them it would be as if a hotel guest took all the sheets off the bed every morning and soaked them in the bathtub - enough people do that, you're going to have to hire extra maids.

lukeschlather 14y ago
Have you ever re-imaged a machine? It's easier than operating an industrial washing machine. (No pesky health codes to worry about.) But they should be re-imaging everything as a rule, regardless. Otherwise you could use their returns system to distribute trojans.
kabdib 14y ago
I had a Lenovo system from Fry's that I couldn't install NT on. In the process of trying to get the install to work, I managed to wipe the restore partition. They wouldn't take it back. "How can we re-sell this?" "It's broken. You can't." "We can't put this back on the shelf without the restore partition." I called my credit card company in front of them and had the charges reversed. "Have fun, boys." I'm sure that some poor sucker got that machine, DOA, and returned it again, with the same hassle.

sequoia 14y ago

"Your display is broken? Oh, you installed cygwin? Sorry, you're on your own: we don't support cygwin" Mostly joking but how far fetched is it to speculate such a thing, given that they are denying display service due to OS install? bittorrent clients can be quite hard on HDDs, I've heard, furthermore illegal torrents are purportedly full of malware which could "damage your computer"; can they reject a defective HDD claim if you have uTorrent installed?

sliverstorm 14y ago
This used to happen with automobiles. It's called the Magnuson-Moss Act.
smackfu 14y ago
Heh, wasn't THAT long ago that setting up your CRT monitor for Linux involved a lot of scary stuff about using invalid frequencies that could cause damage.
- dexen 14y ago
  Only relevant on exceptionally old and broken hardware. Any decent CRT or LCD provides http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EDID http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EDID which lists both standard and non-standard modelines and frequency range. X.org takes that into account, unless you override it by hand. Also, the display will shut itself down if driven over threshold. On the other hand, any software will happily let bad hardware kill itself, if not customized for particular hardware kink. I had a Linux apparently kill a 2.5'' HDD. Turns out OEM configured the drive to unload heads very often, probably to produce impressive power savings -_-' After about one or two years constantly power-on, the drive accumulated its rated number (~500'000) of unloads and died.

papsosouid 14y ago

And just yesterday the story here had tons of people insisting that this was no big deal, just a one time mistake, and that they should shut up and be happy. This is exactly why I didn't consider their initial reaction to be an acceptable resolution. They need to make it 100% clear that you can install whatever OS you want, and they need to make it 100% clear that they are going to train their staff to know their own policies.

powertower 14y ago
1. The original post had a couple of people who experienced Linux drivers throwing the thermal control systems of the laptop in a loop, and damaging it. 2. Was there anything wrong with the laptop (70% of returns work perfectly)? If not, and it is returned in a non-original condition, why the hell would Newegg (who's margins are 1%) accept it and take a loss on it. Again, Newegg makes 1 dollar for every $100 sold, this is the lowest margin in the industry, and is why their prices are cheap... They simply can't cover people burning out their laptops with bad drivers, or accept working laptops with a missing OS, that might or might not have been partially damaged. They also can't cover people buying a laptop simply to see if Linux runs on it, knowing they can just ship it back. They probably don't want that type of business.
- papsosouid 14y ago
  1. If the laptop was damaged because of the user's actions, then that should be their reason for rejecting the RMA. Not "you installed an operating system". 2. If there was nothing wrong with the laptop, then that should be their reason for rejecting the RMA. Not "you installed an operating system". I don't understand why there is such an obsession with their margins. How does that matter to me as a consumer in any way? I am purchasing a product. I expect to be able to return it if it is defective. Period. I do not care why they lie and refuse to accept a return on defective product. I do not care how much or how little money they make. I care that they are an honest business I can trust. If you value doing business with companies based on how little money they make, you are welcome to choose to do business with companies by that criteria. Those of us with different criteria do not become objectively incorrect for using those other criteria for making our decisions.

kenrikm 14y ago

So Amazon it is then! Bye bye NewEgg.. The relationship was nice while it lasted.

alan_cx 14y ago
Yeah, my attitude too. You know, in "dumb punter" mode, I don't care what the small print says and what the fine arguments are. As a punter, if my machine brakes, I want it replaced or fixed, not a legal mumbo jumbo debate. When I buy a PC, I don't want to need a lawyer with me. Basically, it's too much thinking and grief for something so, so simple. Whatever the savings might be, it's simply not worth it.
barik 14y ago
It's a terribly confusing universe these days, and boycotts must depend on the position of the moon. Wasn't that long ago that people wanted to boycott Amazon for doing their silly one-click patent. Or their 1984 Kindle book deletion thing. I'd take a break from HN and go play Diablo III, but alas, I'm supposed to boycott that too because of the bnetd snafu. Instead, I maintain a much simpler lifestyle by ordering from whatever place gives me a reasonable price and good service, regardless of other people's experiences. Both Amazon and New Egg have offered me excellent service in the past, and I will continue to use both.

deleted 14y ago

[deleted]

davidf18 14y ago

The original laptop in question was a Thinkpad. Thinkpads have restore disks. I always install my own OS and then use the restore disks to restore the system to its original purchased condition by using the restore disks. I think most brands work this way. With my Mac Air I have a Bootcamp dual boot with both OSX and Windows 7. One can restore Macs also to their original software installed status.

ihsw 14y ago
Although restore disks are great it might be prudent to buy an additional disk drive and store the stock one away until time comes for RMA or otherwise. This way the condition of the laptop cannot be so easily disputed.

lnanek2 14y ago

Normally I'd say it's difficult for the retailer to support enthusiast needs like this. It can just be too costly. For example, maybe their return inspection policy is to run some Windows test software or something and it would have to be rewritten to multi-platform, or all their inspectors would have to spend time learning how to and reinstalling Windows, etc.. Push them too hard and they will run away from Linux crying due to the higher costs for few sales, like some sellers of hardware with Linux out of the box have done, or competitors not footing the bill will beat them out. It is a very low margin business where just having the automatic conveyor belts to put bins near where the parts have to be picked off the shelves helps immensely. Newegg sells a ton of components to enthusiasts and small time computer shops upgrading and building their machines part by part, however. I think they'd be better off with a more lax policy regarding OS installs considering their customer base.

Symmetry 14y ago
I think most of us would be ok if they had a policy of not supporting Linux returns and they were up front about it. But if they don't support Linux returns but claim to potential customers that they do support them then, well, that's problematic.
keithpeter 14y ago
"For example, maybe their return inspection policy is to run some Windows test software or something and it would have to be rewritten to multi-platform, or all their inspectors would have to spend time learning how to and reinstalling Windows, etc.." Or just boot from another device?
schiffern 14y ago
>For example, maybe their return inspection policy is to run some Windows test software or something Why would anyone run that on the user's OS?? If the point is to test the hardware, wouldn't it make more sense to have a custom USB stick OS that automatically runs the appropriate diagnostics after booting? What's easier: 1) plug in USB stick, power on machine, move on, or 2) power on machine, wait for OS to load, plug in USB stick, install diagnostic software, start diagnostics, which may or may not reflect actual hardware problems since you don't have a known-good OS under you? RMAs typically don't troubleshoot software. Even Apple's hardware return people will only offer to wipe your drive and reinstall (you did back up before sending it in, didn't you?)

antidoh 14y ago

Linux voids your warranty. Huh. In a way I can see their point. You bought hardware, plus a licensed copy of Windows. You returned it without Windows. But really, what does it cost to just re-image the disk? They don't really just resell RMAs without going over them, do they?