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A few notes: 1. Botulism is nearly a non-issue in lacto fermentation. As the article mentions, salt and acid inhibit its growth. For an extra layer of protecti
by hansvm 2y ago
A few notes:
1. Botulism is nearly a non-issue in lacto fermentation. As the article mentions, salt and acid inhibit its growth. For an extra layer of protection, you can add a bit of vinegar at the start of the process to further encourage the growth of safe microorganisms. Botulism only starts becoming an issue when you have low-salt, low-acid preparations, or when you start the process like you would in traditional canning (boiling the fermentation mixture ahead of time -- getting rid of all competition for the botulism). If you cook the peppers you should make sure to pitch in a significant quantity of yeast and/or lactic acid producing bacteria.
1a. Botulism is a lot higher risk if you stabilize the mixture (the "simmering it in a pan to thicken" step) before storing it. That kills any safe microorganisms and again opens up the door for an infection from something dangerous (though, as the article mentions, it's less risky because of the accumulated salt and acid in the final product).
2. Mold requires a stable, aerobic environment to grow. Completely submerging the peppers suffices, as does using some form of air-lock, but you can also almost always get away with just stirring it twice each day.
3. Sugar can make the fermentation work better. The suggestion of fruit to achieve that is a great idea. As a side-note, mango is particularly delicious fermented on its own (halves or other large chunks, fermented just till there's a lot of CO2 bubbles, making them fruit chunks sparkly, no longer or it gets mushy).
> kills off the fermentation.
4. That has pros and cons. Fermented foods "keep" better while still fermenting (in terms of food safety), but the texture and flavor can degrade (it varies, look at how fantastic kimchi is as an example of longer fermentations being beneficial). Once hybrid strategy if you still want the improved texture from cooking is to reserve some of the pre-cooked sauce and re-introduce after cooking, re-innoculating it with yeast and bacteria. It'll tend to keep a lot longer if you do so. The flavor changes can be good or bad. It'll build up pressure over time though, so don't seal it air-tight.
- tptacek 2y agoJust for what it's worth, for all the talk about botulism in all these stories, the US had just nineteen cases of confirmed food-borne botulism in 2019 (the last year I can see data for); about half were commercial, and 4 were an outbreak linked to "home-prepared fermented beluga flipper". I don't think fermented hot sauce is taking anybody out. At least, not that way. (I'm fascinated by this because it's an article of faith that you can't store garlic confit or garlic oil in the fridge, but it's very difficult to find a case of anyone contracting botulism from cooked garlic, and when I get taken out by a case of garlic botulism, you all have my permission to write your dunks directly onto my gravestone).
- kevinmchugh 2y ago> fermented beluga flipper A traditional native Alaskan dish, for anyone else as curious as I was
- hansvm 2y ago> garlic It's right up there with storing cooked rice in the fridge. Garlic you're at least able to cook long enough to kill the botulism spores, but typical fluffy white rice preparations are nowhere close, and if you had enough spores to start with (this being quite rare, hence why illness and death are rare) you'll have a very dangerous concoction brewing in your fridge. > beluga flipper That story's especially wild because it was just a dead whale of unknown age they then processed. Generally though, meats are less safe to ferment than vegetal matter (lower sugar and acid content, higher initial bacterial loads and other parasites). It can be done safely, but where I'm comfortable telling just about anyone veggies and fruits are safe, I'd not want to recommend meat to somebody with the wrong background.
- idlewords 2y agolooks over at jar of garlicky beluga flipper. Uh-oh.
- OJFord 2y agoBotulism is nearly a non-issue full stop, but American food writing always needs FDA recommendations and general fearmongering, for some reason. 15 episodes (62 patient cases) in the UK between 1922 and 2005. https://academic.oup.com/jpubhealth/article/28/4/337/1622732?login=false https://academic.oup.com/jpubhealth/article/28/4/337/1622732... Mostly not home-prepared, and of those that were only one was canned vegetables (mushrooms). It's nasty and can be fatal yes, but in terms of risks in life it just doesn't warrant mentioning, and yet it is so often. (And I do not believe it's bloggers feeling the need to warn about it that's suppressing the numbers!) You're probably more likely to get run over on your way to the shop for whatever you want to can/ferment.
- gwd 2y ago> but American food writing always needs FDA recommendations and general fearmongering, for some reason. Maybe fearmongering is one of the reasons the deaths are so low? That, and the fact that the recipes that have become a part of the culture in many cases happen to be recipes that prevent botulism (i.e., things that are sour).
- OJFord 2y agoMaybe, but I don't believe it: > (And I do not believe it's bloggers feeling the need to warn about it that's suppressing the numbers!) As for safe recipes being established part of the culture (no puns intended?) - yeah, well that's somewhat the point, C. botulinum spores can't be seen, but other things can, we've developed preservation techniques that work for both, it's rare anyway, it doesn't warrant worrying about specifically. It's the nastiest thing that almost certainly isn't going to happen.