2 ms·

By 2050 when the AMOC collapses, Europe will be able to heat itself without greenhouse gases. They're on a pretty good course already, they're not the United St

By 2050 when the AMOC collapses, Europe will be able to heat itself without greenhouse gases. They're on a pretty good course already, they're not the United States.

ben_w 2y ago
That heavily depends on the details of the collapse. Perhaps I'm misunderstanding the other poster's (Ekaros) scenario, but I think they were suggesting emissions of extra CO2 and other greenhouse gases as geo-engineering rather than as a mere power supply, especially given the (CalRobert) mention of starvation. I've seen estimates between 2°C and 30°C of local cooling. I expect the lower range of that hence my previous statement "Europe north of about Paris will look like southern Canada already does", and that's fine for northern Europe but may still bite Spain (the Florida of Europe) as it (or at least its Med coast) is destined for being too hot more than being too cold. Agriculture is the main thing, and I don't feel confident about predicting that, might be OK or not. 30°C of local cooling (I have no idea how that might even be possible but I've seen it as the worst case estimate) is way outside what most of the buildings are designed for.
- lamontcg 2y ago
  30C of cooling is pretty clearly ludicrous. And geoengineering to spew more CO2 into the atmosphere won't really work and is idiotic enough, it won't happen. I guess I didn't understand that line of argument because of how ridiculous it is. Much more likely that Europe just switches to energy-intensive hydroponic farming and to imports for whatever that doesn't work for.
  - ben_w 2y ago
    > And geoengineering to spew more CO2 into the atmosphere won't really work and is idiotic enough, On this we both agree :) > it won't happen Sadly this doesn't follow from the premise; governments regularly do stupid things that don't work.

2 ms·

By 2050 when the AMOC collapses, Europe will be able to heat itself without greenhouse gases. They're on a pretty good course already, they're not the United St

by lamontcg 2y ago

By 2050 when the AMOC collapses, Europe will be able to heat itself without greenhouse gases. They're on a pretty good course already, they're not the United States.

ben_w 2y ago
That heavily depends on the details of the collapse. Perhaps I'm misunderstanding the other poster's (Ekaros) scenario, but I think they were suggesting emissions of extra CO2 and other greenhouse gases as geo-engineering rather than as a mere power supply, especially given the (CalRobert) mention of starvation. I've seen estimates between 2°C and 30°C of local cooling. I expect the lower range of that hence my previous statement "Europe north of about Paris will look like southern Canada already does", and that's fine for northern Europe but may still bite Spain (the Florida of Europe) as it (or at least its Med coast) is destined for being too hot more than being too cold. Agriculture is the main thing, and I don't feel confident about predicting that, might be OK or not. 30°C of local cooling (I have no idea how that might even be possible but I've seen it as the worst case estimate) is way outside what most of the buildings are designed for.
- lamontcg 2y ago
  30C of cooling is pretty clearly ludicrous. And geoengineering to spew more CO2 into the atmosphere won't really work and is idiotic enough, it won't happen. I guess I didn't understand that line of argument because of how ridiculous it is. Much more likely that Europe just switches to energy-intensive hydroponic farming and to imports for whatever that doesn't work for.
  - ben_w 2y ago
    > And geoengineering to spew more CO2 into the atmosphere won't really work and is idiotic enough, On this we both agree :) > it won't happen Sadly this doesn't follow from the premise; governments regularly do stupid things that don't work.