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Longshoreman is unskilled labor, not a trade. Plumbers, electricians, etc. don't have an excess of backbreaking work and if anything, the work might be physical

Longshoreman is unskilled labor, not a trade. Plumbers, electricians, etc. don't have an excess of backbreaking work and if anything, the work might be physically preferable to sitting in a chair all day.

TrackerFF 2y ago
I actually also worked as an apprentice (electrician) for a year before deciding I wanted to pursue electrical engineering. I mean, it's a demanding job, too. You work with your hands raised up a lot, you'll have to get into all kinds of places, and there's always the possibility of getting electrocuted. Most of the guys I started with became electricians, and have since pursued "office" jobs in the trade, in other words getting their engineering degree , so that they can work inside. A fair share of them have also experience stress injuries in arms, shoulders before hitting 30.
Ekaros 2y ago
What is really definition of backbreaking work here? Moving sacks of cement or digging by hand all day? Somehow I feel that many of these trades are bit glorified and reality is much harsher. Often there is parts of job that means moving heavy items occasionally. And often lot of the job happens in less than desirable locations where for example you need to keep hands above head for long time or pull quite heavy cables or pipes around.
- keiferski 2y ago
  Well, a longshoreman is pretty much by definition physical work, because you’re moving heavy stuff around. Being an electrician or plumber may involve being in uncomfortable positions or workplaces for long periods of time, but I don’t think I’d call it “backbreaking.”
  - Ekaros 2y ago
    I don't think too much of that work happens by hand anymore. Most of it is by machine or simply securing cargo. Not that dealing with chains and like is lightest job. But days of manual labour happening are quite gone.
    - keiferski 2y ago
      So are you saying that the job doesn’t qualify as backbreaking either?
  - jjj123 2y ago
    Being in uncomfortable positions all day is absolutely one way to give yourself long term back injuries. I’d still describe it as “back breaking” even if you might not break your back with one big movement.
__rito__ 2y ago
Even if you are a plumber or an electrician, the job gets physically very demanding and hard when you are in your late 40s and early 50s. It is near impossible when you are 60+. The charm of white collar labor is, you can keep doing it till, say, 65. With the same productivity, if not more. Say, you are a bank teller or a cashier. You can be as effective, if not more, as you were in 35. That's why almost all people, who have even a slight chance, want a white collar job. If you know a plumber or electrician, in his late 40s and early 50s, or older. Talk to them. Ask about their reality and situation. Some of your misconceptions might go away. Electrician is not sitting in a heated room and working on a toaster. It is also wiring industrial buildings, apartment buildings, etc. standing on stools and ladders before those places have heating or AC or lights- in ten degrees or hundred. That's just one example.
- Fire-Dragon-DoL 2y ago
  My wife's dad, electrician, did it all the way into the 70s
- keiferski 2y ago
  I know many people with these jobs, almost certainly more than you, as I grew up around them, not white collar people. Almost all of them worked just fine until their late 60s. People seem to forget that being mobile into your 60s used to be an entirely normal thing. It’s only fairly recently that obesity, reliance on cars, and sedentary lifestyles have made being mobile in middle age a difficult thing.
- Ekaros 2y ago
  Or alternatively they are kneeling on the floor. Just look at your average room. Where are the outlets usually? Even with kneepads that can't be good for your knees. And most outlets are in pretty easy to access locations with reasonable amount of room around them.
- beej71 2y ago
  > Even if you are a plumber or an electrician, the job gets physically very demanding and hard when you are in your late 40s and early 50s. It is near impossible when you are 60+. Exactly like software development, then, except for the physically-demanding part. :)

TrackerFF 2y ago

I actually also worked as an apprentice (electrician) for a year before deciding I wanted to pursue electrical engineering. I mean, it's a demanding job, too. You work with your hands raised up a lot, you'll have to get into all kinds of places, and there's always the possibility of getting electrocuted. Most of the guys I started with became electricians, and have since pursued "office" jobs in the trade, in other words getting their engineering degree , so that they can work inside. A fair share of them have also experience stress injuries in arms, shoulders before hitting 30.

Ekaros 2y ago

What is really definition of backbreaking work here? Moving sacks of cement or digging by hand all day? Somehow I feel that many of these trades are bit glorified and reality is much harsher. Often there is parts of job that means moving heavy items occasionally. And often lot of the job happens in less than desirable locations where for example you need to keep hands above head for long time or pull quite heavy cables or pipes around.

keiferski 2y ago
Well, a longshoreman is pretty much by definition physical work, because you’re moving heavy stuff around. Being an electrician or plumber may involve being in uncomfortable positions or workplaces for long periods of time, but I don’t think I’d call it “backbreaking.”
- Ekaros 2y ago
  I don't think too much of that work happens by hand anymore. Most of it is by machine or simply securing cargo. Not that dealing with chains and like is lightest job. But days of manual labour happening are quite gone.
  - keiferski 2y ago
    So are you saying that the job doesn’t qualify as backbreaking either?
- jjj123 2y ago
  Being in uncomfortable positions all day is absolutely one way to give yourself long term back injuries. I’d still describe it as “back breaking” even if you might not break your back with one big movement.

__rito__ 2y ago

Even if you are a plumber or an electrician, the job gets physically very demanding and hard when you are in your late 40s and early 50s. It is near impossible when you are 60+. The charm of white collar labor is, you can keep doing it till, say, 65. With the same productivity, if not more. Say, you are a bank teller or a cashier. You can be as effective, if not more, as you were in 35. That's why almost all people, who have even a slight chance, want a white collar job. If you know a plumber or electrician, in his late 40s and early 50s, or older. Talk to them. Ask about their reality and situation. Some of your misconceptions might go away. Electrician is not sitting in a heated room and working on a toaster. It is also wiring industrial buildings, apartment buildings, etc. standing on stools and ladders before those places have heating or AC or lights- in ten degrees or hundred. That's just one example.

Fire-Dragon-DoL 2y ago
My wife's dad, electrician, did it all the way into the 70s
keiferski 2y ago
I know many people with these jobs, almost certainly more than you, as I grew up around them, not white collar people. Almost all of them worked just fine until their late 60s. People seem to forget that being mobile into your 60s used to be an entirely normal thing. It’s only fairly recently that obesity, reliance on cars, and sedentary lifestyles have made being mobile in middle age a difficult thing.
Ekaros 2y ago
Or alternatively they are kneeling on the floor. Just look at your average room. Where are the outlets usually? Even with kneepads that can't be good for your knees. And most outlets are in pretty easy to access locations with reasonable amount of room around them.
beej71 2y ago
> Even if you are a plumber or an electrician, the job gets physically very demanding and hard when you are in your late 40s and early 50s. It is near impossible when you are 60+. Exactly like software development, then, except for the physically-demanding part. :)