4 ms·

I don't know. I think this is a bit pointless. I'd rather see "a hat" for Intel N100. I have Pi 5 and I wish I bought N100. It's unstable, loses internet conne

I don't know. I think this is a bit pointless. I'd rather see "a hat" for Intel N100. I have Pi 5 and I wish I bought N100. It's unstable, loses internet connection after few days and I have to manually power cycle it. NVMe is patchy, I had to buy a few modules until I found one that is working, but I don't trust it. Seems like RPi 5 was rushed to stay relevant, but it wasn't thought through.

jsheard 2y ago
Those small AI modules use the same form factor as standard WiFi cards so you don't really need a specialized hat, you could just plug that module straight into many N100 machines in lieu of WiFi. edit: as mentioned below, make sure the machine you buy has a socketed WiFi module.
- person4268 2y ago
  That might not work; I recently disassembled a mini PC with an Intel N95, and the wifi chip was soldered and integrated into the mainboard. Now, if the SSD was NVMe, I suppose you could use that for PCIe (possibly with some sort of adapter?) and boot from some other form of storage, of course.
- linotype 2y ago
  Yeah just make sure to buy one of the models with a 2.5” drive for storage, or one with two NVME slots. Then you get to keep WiFi as well.
moffkalast 2y ago
Any N100 board that has a PCIe connector exposed is basically mini ITX sized, which kind of defeats the whole purpose of a SBC imo. There are lots of problems with the Pi 5 (the absurd power draw, the lack of eMMC, breaking 10 years of GPIO compatibility), but the PCIe connector is definitely not one of them. In fact it's probably the best thing about it by far because it sets up a new standard, and soon every random SBC will have the same PCIe out port so they can run all of these compatible boards. Some might even support more than one lane eventually.
- perryh2 2y ago
  There are card-sized SBCs with the Intel N100. Very cool. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41007348 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41007348
  - rcarmo 2y ago
    I’ll be posting my review of that in a few hours…
    - moffkalast 2y ago
      Please, please, please, can you run a memory benchmark? Would be great to see how it compares against the rest: https://openbenchmarking.org/result/2404119-TJ-2404112NE14&grs https://openbenchmarking.org/result/2404119-TJ-2404112NE14&g...
      - rcarmo 2y ago
        I can give it a go. Review is linked from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41145937 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41145937
      - rcarmo 2y ago
        https://openbenchmarking.org/result/2408033-NE-2404119TJ50 https://openbenchmarking.org/result/2408033-NE-2404119TJ50
        moffkalast 2y ago
        Ah thank you! That's actually quite a bit lower than I would've expected. Especially how it lags behind the rest in write perf. Also found this geerling review [0] today (which mentions yours as well) which does list slightly higher numbers but he notes that he used actual thermal paste to get better cooling with that gaping heatsink box, which seems to have helped on at least a few fronts. If your cooling theory about the G2 holds, then the memory might be overheating on the X4. [0] https://github.com/geerlingguy/sbc-reviews/issues/48 https://github.com/geerlingguy/sbc-reviews/issues/48
404mm 2y ago
I have N100 from beelink and it came with NVMe slot. The purchase price, including RAM and SSD was around ~$140 (16G RAM, 256GB SSD). And the performance is in multiples of Pi. Never had any issues with stability but I never put any more serious load on it either. My last Pi is 4 and Pi5 is just completely pointless to me.
worstspotgain 2y ago
Don't even bother with the N100 anymore, IMO, unless board size is a strict requirement. You can buy i5-12450H and i9-12900H mini PCs in the $200-$400 range on Prime Day/Black Friday. I agree that the RPi5 doesn't make much sense. NVMe needs to be built in at a minimum, and the specialized PSU requirement is a PITA.
- ssl-3 2y ago
  What I take from this is that if I have a project in mind that I want to do right now and it requires a very small computer, then I should not do that project. Instead, I should wait a few months (or most of a year), triple my budget, and make room for a larger system.
  - worstspotgain 2y ago
    Or go ahead and make whichever choice right now and regret your purchase later, or don't. The keyword was IMO. Obviously if $200 is tripling your budget then you're leaving some unneeded peripheral out. The N100 probably won't work either as the cheapest one on Amazon is apparently $120.
    - ssl-3 2y ago
      The median of the price range listed is $300. N100 boxes are available for purchase today (not just sometime in the mysterious future) for less than $100, delivered. $300 ÷ $100 = 3, hence: Tripling the budget. (I could have picked the high end of the range, just as you selected the low end, but that would have been disingenuous of me. $300 is right in the middle.)
      - worstspotgain 2y ago
        The range I gave is based on CPU/RAM/SSD specs obviously, so your N100 system should be specced to match. Here's an i7-11390H/16GB/512GB system you can buy today on Amazon from a somewhat reputable Chinese brand for $170. Its CPU is ~50% faster than a N100 single-threaded and ~80% faster multi-threaded: https://www.amazon.com/ACEMAGIC-11390H-Computer-Desktop-Support/dp/B0C9HWT7TL/ https://www.amazon.com/ACEMAGIC-11390H-Computer-Desktop-Supp... A similarly priced system with a much faster CPU will be on sale in 3 months, maybe sooner. Feel free to spec a similar N100 system on Amazon (or Newegg or a similarly reputable vendor with no-questions-asked returns) for much less.

jsheard 2y ago

Those small AI modules use the same form factor as standard WiFi cards so you don't really need a specialized hat, you could just plug that module straight into many N100 machines in lieu of WiFi. edit: as mentioned below, make sure the machine you buy has a socketed WiFi module.

person4268 2y ago
That might not work; I recently disassembled a mini PC with an Intel N95, and the wifi chip was soldered and integrated into the mainboard. Now, if the SSD was NVMe, I suppose you could use that for PCIe (possibly with some sort of adapter?) and boot from some other form of storage, of course.
linotype 2y ago
Yeah just make sure to buy one of the models with a 2.5” drive for storage, or one with two NVME slots. Then you get to keep WiFi as well.

moffkalast 2y ago

Any N100 board that has a PCIe connector exposed is basically mini ITX sized, which kind of defeats the whole purpose of a SBC imo. There are lots of problems with the Pi 5 (the absurd power draw, the lack of eMMC, breaking 10 years of GPIO compatibility), but the PCIe connector is definitely not one of them. In fact it's probably the best thing about it by far because it sets up a new standard, and soon every random SBC will have the same PCIe out port so they can run all of these compatible boards. Some might even support more than one lane eventually.

perryh2 2y ago
There are card-sized SBCs with the Intel N100. Very cool. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41007348 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41007348
- rcarmo 2y ago
  I’ll be posting my review of that in a few hours…
  - moffkalast 2y ago
    Please, please, please, can you run a memory benchmark? Would be great to see how it compares against the rest: https://openbenchmarking.org/result/2404119-TJ-2404112NE14&grs https://openbenchmarking.org/result/2404119-TJ-2404112NE14&g...
    - rcarmo 2y ago
      I can give it a go. Review is linked from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41145937 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41145937
    - rcarmo 2y ago
      https://openbenchmarking.org/result/2408033-NE-2404119TJ50 https://openbenchmarking.org/result/2408033-NE-2404119TJ50
      - moffkalast 2y ago
        Ah thank you! That's actually quite a bit lower than I would've expected. Especially how it lags behind the rest in write perf. Also found this geerling review [0] today (which mentions yours as well) which does list slightly higher numbers but he notes that he used actual thermal paste to get better cooling with that gaping heatsink box, which seems to have helped on at least a few fronts. If your cooling theory about the G2 holds, then the memory might be overheating on the X4. [0] https://github.com/geerlingguy/sbc-reviews/issues/48 https://github.com/geerlingguy/sbc-reviews/issues/48

404mm 2y ago

I have N100 from beelink and it came with NVMe slot. The purchase price, including RAM and SSD was around ~$140 (16G RAM, 256GB SSD). And the performance is in multiples of Pi. Never had any issues with stability but I never put any more serious load on it either. My last Pi is 4 and Pi5 is just completely pointless to me.

worstspotgain 2y ago

Don't even bother with the N100 anymore, IMO, unless board size is a strict requirement. You can buy i5-12450H and i9-12900H mini PCs in the $200-$400 range on Prime Day/Black Friday. I agree that the RPi5 doesn't make much sense. NVMe needs to be built in at a minimum, and the specialized PSU requirement is a PITA.

ssl-3 2y ago
What I take from this is that if I have a project in mind that I want to do right now and it requires a very small computer, then I should not do that project. Instead, I should wait a few months (or most of a year), triple my budget, and make room for a larger system.
- worstspotgain 2y ago
  Or go ahead and make whichever choice right now and regret your purchase later, or don't. The keyword was IMO. Obviously if $200 is tripling your budget then you're leaving some unneeded peripheral out. The N100 probably won't work either as the cheapest one on Amazon is apparently $120.
  - ssl-3 2y ago
    The median of the price range listed is $300. N100 boxes are available for purchase today (not just sometime in the mysterious future) for less than $100, delivered. $300 ÷ $100 = 3, hence: Tripling the budget. (I could have picked the high end of the range, just as you selected the low end, but that would have been disingenuous of me. $300 is right in the middle.)
    - worstspotgain 2y ago
      The range I gave is based on CPU/RAM/SSD specs obviously, so your N100 system should be specced to match. Here's an i7-11390H/16GB/512GB system you can buy today on Amazon from a somewhat reputable Chinese brand for $170. Its CPU is ~50% faster than a N100 single-threaded and ~80% faster multi-threaded: https://www.amazon.com/ACEMAGIC-11390H-Computer-Desktop-Support/dp/B0C9HWT7TL/ https://www.amazon.com/ACEMAGIC-11390H-Computer-Desktop-Supp... A similarly priced system with a much faster CPU will be on sale in 3 months, maybe sooner. Feel free to spec a similar N100 system on Amazon (or Newegg or a similarly reputable vendor with no-questions-asked returns) for much less.