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I was at a bakery grand opening from an uneducated rural family. Plenty of their rural friends listened to the difficulties, wished them the best. Bring in th

I was at a bakery grand opening from an uneducated rural family. Plenty of their rural friends listened to the difficulties, wished them the best. Bring in the MBA + Industrial Engineer, and tell them some advice on processes, economics, and as a bonus, I was an Electrical Engineer for a few years so I had some advice on their oven problem. What is better? The person that says "You look beautiful", or "You have a piece of fuzz in your hair?"

stavros 2y ago
Sometimes I want to hear that I'm beautiful, even with the fuzz in my hair.
- sowerssix 2y ago
  You are beautiful, even with the fuzz in my hair.
MikeTheGreat 2y ago
Thank you for sharing! Based on your last sentence I think we're in agreement that it's probably not great to give someone unsolicited advice (but it's fine if we disagree). I wanted to throw out a couple more thoughts: I think that having experience in the business (or not) is important. I think that sometimes giving advice on an area that one doesn't have experience in can be a weird way to put oneself in a 'one up' position. Kind of a "Look, I don't even do your job, but let me tell you how to do it better" kind of statement. I'm not saying that this was your intention or your effect but I think it's something engineers are prone to - I know I've done this. Wasn't there even a name for this? Something about "dinner party advice"? If this rings a bell for anyone I'd appreciate the help about this. Sometimes I've found that if I have experience in the area I can suggest a small change with a substantial benefit (because I've actually done this enough times to know that the advice will actually help, actually) but even there I'd be really hesitant to offer unsolicited advice. And, as an added bonus, consider that they may have already committed to what they're doing. In which case, even if you're right, you're basically telling them that they've done something wrong - maybe they can fix it (with more effort and/or money) maybe they can't, but that's gotta be an extra burden for them.
- ahartman00 2y ago
  I've heard it called engineer's syndrome. "You start believing that since you're an excellent engineer in one specialty, then you're a friggin' genius in everything you do, because it's all the same, really" [0] It apparently affects physicists too, and must be common enough to warrant two xkcds. [1][2] 0. https://web.archive.org/web/20071226220909/http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2704,2204613,00.asp https://web.archive.org/web/20071226220909/http://www.pcmag.... 1. https://xkcd.com/1831/ https://xkcd.com/1831/ 2. https://xkcd.com/793/ https://xkcd.com/793/
  - resource_waste 2y ago
    To be fair, engineers are rational. You don't get that with other professions. It makes them great for advice because they arent going to use emotions or hopes. But also, in this case, me and my wife are 2 business owners that have been doing it for a decade. This person started a few weeks ago.
thaumasiotes 2y ago
https://books.google.com/books?id=uJQbhDs4dMMC&pg=PA47&lpg=PA47&dq=sherman%27s+lagoon+%22what+everyone+needs+is+a+good+enemy%22&source=bl&ots=hyG1cigoiR&sig=ACfU3U1b5WxZfWhiwL0jiyqp0jGdP0lKtQ&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiu-Y3wsc-HAxXmHjQIHbXhCPYQ6AF6BAgMEAM#v=onepage&q=sherman's%20lagoon%20%22what%20everyone%20needs%20is%20a%20good%20enemy%22&f=false https://books.google.com/books?id=uJQbhDs4dMMC&pg=PA47&lpg=P...
sqeaky 2y ago
Depends on context. If someone just needs the emotional energy to get back into the fight then a compliment is often what is needed. If someone is about to do something imminently that you see a correctable fault with and they don't then pointing it out is likely correct. So many people up here thinking there is always 1 exactly right course of action! Why?! Why do so many otherwise smart people fall back to the silliest of binary thinking and heuristics?
- dakiol 2y ago
  > So many people up here thinking there is always 1 exactly right course of action! Why?! Why do so many otherwise smart people fall back to the silliest of binary thinking and heuristics? I was one of those. I know the answer: I wasn't/I'm not that intelligent. I learnt that being technically right is not as important as I thought (and I also learnt to care less about it specially when I'm surrounded by other technical people).
  - sqeaky 2y ago
    Reflection is a form of intelligence. Being able to acknowledge you were once wrong is not a skill everyone has (and being technically correct is a super important part of being smart at least in tech). I hope you see how smart you are and keep getting smarter.
  - Jensson 2y ago
    > I learnt that being technically right is not as important as I thought Only in discussions, whenever you do anything being right is the most important thing as doing the wrong thing is just contra productive, being right saves a massive amount of time and work.
    - sqeaky 2y ago
      Careful to not get sucked into a binary trap. Most (but not all) problems exist on a gradient you can often be "right enough", "fast enough", and as uncomfortable as it seems we can be "correct enough" or even "coherent enough" to succeed.

stavros 2y ago

Sometimes I want to hear that I'm beautiful, even with the fuzz in my hair.

sowerssix 2y ago
You are beautiful, even with the fuzz in my hair.

MikeTheGreat 2y ago

Thank you for sharing! Based on your last sentence I think we're in agreement that it's probably not great to give someone unsolicited advice (but it's fine if we disagree). I wanted to throw out a couple more thoughts: I think that having experience in the business (or not) is important. I think that sometimes giving advice on an area that one doesn't have experience in can be a weird way to put oneself in a 'one up' position. Kind of a "Look, I don't even do your job, but let me tell you how to do it better" kind of statement. I'm not saying that this was your intention or your effect but I think it's something engineers are prone to - I know I've done this. Wasn't there even a name for this? Something about "dinner party advice"? If this rings a bell for anyone I'd appreciate the help about this. Sometimes I've found that if I have experience in the area I can suggest a small change with a substantial benefit (because I've actually done this enough times to know that the advice will actually help, actually) but even there I'd be really hesitant to offer unsolicited advice. And, as an added bonus, consider that they may have already committed to what they're doing. In which case, even if you're right, you're basically telling them that they've done something wrong - maybe they can fix it (with more effort and/or money) maybe they can't, but that's gotta be an extra burden for them.

ahartman00 2y ago
I've heard it called engineer's syndrome. "You start believing that since you're an excellent engineer in one specialty, then you're a friggin' genius in everything you do, because it's all the same, really" [0] It apparently affects physicists too, and must be common enough to warrant two xkcds. [1][2] 0. https://web.archive.org/web/20071226220909/http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2704,2204613,00.asp https://web.archive.org/web/20071226220909/http://www.pcmag.... 1. https://xkcd.com/1831/ https://xkcd.com/1831/ 2. https://xkcd.com/793/ https://xkcd.com/793/
- resource_waste 2y ago
  To be fair, engineers are rational. You don't get that with other professions. It makes them great for advice because they arent going to use emotions or hopes. But also, in this case, me and my wife are 2 business owners that have been doing it for a decade. This person started a few weeks ago.

thaumasiotes 2y ago

https://books.google.com/books?id=uJQbhDs4dMMC&pg=PA47&lpg=PA47&dq=sherman%27s+lagoon+%22what+everyone+needs+is+a+good+enemy%22&source=bl&ots=hyG1cigoiR&sig=ACfU3U1b5WxZfWhiwL0jiyqp0jGdP0lKtQ&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiu-Y3wsc-HAxXmHjQIHbXhCPYQ6AF6BAgMEAM#v=onepage&q=sherman's%20lagoon%20%22what%20everyone%20needs%20is%20a%20good%20enemy%22&f=false https://books.google.com/books?id=uJQbhDs4dMMC&pg=PA47&lpg=P...

sqeaky 2y ago

Depends on context. If someone just needs the emotional energy to get back into the fight then a compliment is often what is needed. If someone is about to do something imminently that you see a correctable fault with and they don't then pointing it out is likely correct. So many people up here thinking there is always 1 exactly right course of action! Why?! Why do so many otherwise smart people fall back to the silliest of binary thinking and heuristics?

dakiol 2y ago
> So many people up here thinking there is always 1 exactly right course of action! Why?! Why do so many otherwise smart people fall back to the silliest of binary thinking and heuristics? I was one of those. I know the answer: I wasn't/I'm not that intelligent. I learnt that being technically right is not as important as I thought (and I also learnt to care less about it specially when I'm surrounded by other technical people).
- sqeaky 2y ago
  Reflection is a form of intelligence. Being able to acknowledge you were once wrong is not a skill everyone has (and being technically correct is a super important part of being smart at least in tech). I hope you see how smart you are and keep getting smarter.
- Jensson 2y ago
  > I learnt that being technically right is not as important as I thought Only in discussions, whenever you do anything being right is the most important thing as doing the wrong thing is just contra productive, being right saves a massive amount of time and work.
  - sqeaky 2y ago
    Careful to not get sucked into a binary trap. Most (but not all) problems exist on a gradient you can often be "right enough", "fast enough", and as uncomfortable as it seems we can be "correct enough" or even "coherent enough" to succeed.