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This is just the "engineers are ADHD children and need an adult (manager) to keep them on task" schtick. Give the engineers clear requirements and let them int

This is just the "engineers are ADHD children and need an adult (manager) to keep them on task" schtick. Give the engineers clear requirements and let them interact with the stakeholders. Get rid of the intermediaries and knowledge brokers.

AmericanChopper 2y ago
Engineers with decent social skills tend to get promoted into roles where they're managing stakeholder relationships.
- lolinder 2y ago
  And said engineers often end up wishing they hadn't. Interacting directly with stakeholders isn't all it's cracked up to be. Maybe I've just had good luck with product managers, but I tend to enjoy my work the most when someone else is filtering the stakeholders' long and constantly changing wishlist for me and turning it into something coherent and actionable.
- vishnugupta 2y ago
  That's how it was in the initial days/years. However those days are long gone. Now there are these Product Managers who have absolutely no clue how software is built. Interestingly I'm seeing similar trend in many other fields; my car goes to servicing and there's some dude who just knows jargons interfacing with me, for the minutest of my questions he will "get back to me after consulting the line workers", same with my house construction. I had to get through 4 layers of people to finally get to the person who is actually doing the electrical wiring to clearly explain what is it that I wanted.
  - candiddevmike 2y ago
    Hopefully LLMs will replace all of the "I deal with the god damn customers so the engineers don't have to" folks
  - SoftTalker 2y ago
    > my car goes to servicing and there's some dude who just knows jargons interfacing with me, for the minutest of my questions he will "get back to me after consulting the line workers" That's because he's not there to explain what they are doing. He likely doesn't know a spark plug from a fuel injector. He's there to sell you more services.
rectang 2y ago
I see no tools in this article for managers who wish to optimize the productivity of their team while taking into account the natural, unfortunate, human tendency towards perfectionism. It’s an unsophisticated and unrevealing analysis.
raverbashing 2y ago
> and let them interact with the stakeholders There are several reasons why this is not a good idea. And those reasons show itself usually quickly once that is tried.
mypalmike 2y ago
Bit of an aside... In my experience, game companies are particularly prone to treating engineers like children in this and other ways.
tamimio 2y ago
Spot on, it’s so frustrating with all these hoops some companies put in place, and the middle managers at some point start to act as wranglers.. Not to mention the gap that always happens between the engineers (who build and do the work) and the clients or stakeholders (who require the work), which always ends up with last-minute changes and fixes before the demo.

AmericanChopper 2y ago

Engineers with decent social skills tend to get promoted into roles where they're managing stakeholder relationships.

lolinder 2y ago
And said engineers often end up wishing they hadn't. Interacting directly with stakeholders isn't all it's cracked up to be. Maybe I've just had good luck with product managers, but I tend to enjoy my work the most when someone else is filtering the stakeholders' long and constantly changing wishlist for me and turning it into something coherent and actionable.
vishnugupta 2y ago
That's how it was in the initial days/years. However those days are long gone. Now there are these Product Managers who have absolutely no clue how software is built. Interestingly I'm seeing similar trend in many other fields; my car goes to servicing and there's some dude who just knows jargons interfacing with me, for the minutest of my questions he will "get back to me after consulting the line workers", same with my house construction. I had to get through 4 layers of people to finally get to the person who is actually doing the electrical wiring to clearly explain what is it that I wanted.
- candiddevmike 2y ago
  Hopefully LLMs will replace all of the "I deal with the god damn customers so the engineers don't have to" folks
- SoftTalker 2y ago
  > my car goes to servicing and there's some dude who just knows jargons interfacing with me, for the minutest of my questions he will "get back to me after consulting the line workers" That's because he's not there to explain what they are doing. He likely doesn't know a spark plug from a fuel injector. He's there to sell you more services.

rectang 2y ago

I see no tools in this article for managers who wish to optimize the productivity of their team while taking into account the natural, unfortunate, human tendency towards perfectionism. It’s an unsophisticated and unrevealing analysis.

raverbashing 2y ago

> and let them interact with the stakeholders There are several reasons why this is not a good idea. And those reasons show itself usually quickly once that is tried.

mypalmike 2y ago

Bit of an aside... In my experience, game companies are particularly prone to treating engineers like children in this and other ways.

tamimio 2y ago

Spot on, it’s so frustrating with all these hoops some companies put in place, and the middle managers at some point start to act as wranglers.. Not to mention the gap that always happens between the engineers (who build and do the work) and the clients or stakeholders (who require the work), which always ends up with last-minute changes and fixes before the demo.