5 ms·

> everybody pays a negligible amount into the kitty I'm not sure this amount can be negligible even if we were able to make the system economically efficient s

by Zak 2y ago

> everybody pays a negligible amount into the kitty I'm not sure this amount can be negligible even if we were able to make the system economically efficient such that no entities have outsized profit margins. Some things about modern medicine are just expensive. Discovering a new drug and bringing it to market takes a long time and probably has to if we want drugs that work and don't do more harm than good. Growing monoclonal antibodies, which are wonderdrugs for certain conditions, is a resource-intensive process. Even more mundane stuff is expensive. Surgery requires a team of highly skilled professionals. An MRI machine is expensive to own and operate.

AlotOfReading 2y ago
Modern semiconductors are also expensive. Designing a new iPhone and bringing it to market takes a long time. Fabbing the semiconductors is a resource-intensive process. Even more mundane stuff is expensive. There's a team of highly skilled professionals who just deal with the waterproofing gaskets. A lithography machine is expensive to own and operate. ---- Essentially the same arguments apply to semiconductors as medicine yet I can buy an iPhone for <$2k and still give Apple an extremely generous margin on it. That wonderdrug might cost thousands more despite having a fraction of the people involved in its design/manufacturing, most being paid far less. Scale is part of it, but things like insulin or epinephrine are being produced by the ton with simple processes and still cost hundreds of dollars a year for people. It's not certification either, as other countries don't have the same issues or pay the same high prices.
- a2800276 2y ago
  Yeah, but typically your kids don't die if you can't afford a new iPhone.
  - reverius42 2y ago
    That changes the argument from “it’s expensive to develop new drugs” to “it’s expensive to be the victim of extortion” though.
- Zak 2y ago
  Sure, insulin doesn't have to be expensive, and shouldn't be. Economies of scale work for insulin, and it doesn't require recent expensive research in order to be made commercially available. Benralizumab and tebentafusp are probably very expensive to make and took a lot of work to develop and test. Not very many people need them, but the people who do are likely to die horribly without them.
silverquiet 2y ago
I'd look at the costs in other countries as an example of what things could cost. Even domestically I've been looking at a doctor who runs his own surgical center for an operation I might need, and he claims he is able to keep the costs down and provide better care than going through a large hospital system (though he does that as well for patients who may require it). As an example, his facility charges $600 for an MRI which seems quite good.

by Zak 2y ago

AlotOfReading 2y ago

Modern semiconductors are also expensive. Designing a new iPhone and bringing it to market takes a long time. Fabbing the semiconductors is a resource-intensive process. Even more mundane stuff is expensive. There's a team of highly skilled professionals who just deal with the waterproofing gaskets. A lithography machine is expensive to own and operate. ---- Essentially the same arguments apply to semiconductors as medicine yet I can buy an iPhone for <$2k and still give Apple an extremely generous margin on it. That wonderdrug might cost thousands more despite having a fraction of the people involved in its design/manufacturing, most being paid far less. Scale is part of it, but things like insulin or epinephrine are being produced by the ton with simple processes and still cost hundreds of dollars a year for people. It's not certification either, as other countries don't have the same issues or pay the same high prices.

a2800276 2y ago
Yeah, but typically your kids don't die if you can't afford a new iPhone.
- reverius42 2y ago
  That changes the argument from “it’s expensive to develop new drugs” to “it’s expensive to be the victim of extortion” though.
Zak 2y ago
Sure, insulin doesn't have to be expensive, and shouldn't be. Economies of scale work for insulin, and it doesn't require recent expensive research in order to be made commercially available. Benralizumab and tebentafusp are probably very expensive to make and took a lot of work to develop and test. Not very many people need them, but the people who do are likely to die horribly without them.

silverquiet 2y ago

I'd look at the costs in other countries as an example of what things could cost. Even domestically I've been looking at a doctor who runs his own surgical center for an operation I might need, and he claims he is able to keep the costs down and provide better care than going through a large hospital system (though he does that as well for patients who may require it). As an example, his facility charges $600 for an MRI which seems quite good.