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> US also played a role in post-WWI peace deals which eventually lead to world war part II. Woodrow Wilson's proposed peace deal didn't involve imposing harsh

by kibwen 2y ago

> US also played a role in post-WWI peace deals which eventually lead to world war part II. Woodrow Wilson's proposed peace deal didn't involve imposing harsh reparations on Germany. That was the doing of Georges Clemenceau, the prime minister of France, who was under pressure to make Germany's reparations bill as large as possible as retribution for the war.

bojan 2y ago
While that is true, it is really important to add that that doesn't absolve the Germans one bit.
- kibwen 2y ago
  Indeed, though it's also true that the Germans should be held accountable for their own actions during the war, and not solely held responsible for WWI itself, which was a continent-wide effort.
  - globalnode 2y ago
    why should they be? none of the so called winners are held accountable for their actions. best we can do is forget it all and move on, otherwise it will forever be a case of finger pointing.
    - kibwen 2y ago
      By "the Germans" I don't mean modern-day Germans, I mean the people of the era. And indeed, nobody should get a pass for the atrocities of war, the winners included. But no, we should not "forget it all", that's the worst possible thing you could do. The war happened, it was terrible, its consequences reverberate to this day, and we should all remember how it happened and why so that we can attempt to avoid having it happen again.
mantas 2y ago
There’s another important bit. Wilson policies played a big role in creating fractured Central Europe in interwar. I’m personally torn on this. On one hand, this gave my country a chance for independence. On the other hand, this made a bunch of puppets for Germany and Russia to play with. Maybe a unified buffer would have prevented WWII.
- kibwen 2y ago
  It's fine to speculate what could have been, but historically the record for regional "nation building" of this sort has been mixed at best, given the examples of former Czechoslovakia and Yugoslavia.
  - mantas 2y ago
    Yep. But it was a mess either way. On the other hand, if there was some sort of Central Europe superpower building, Poland would probably have abused that. As it did anyway eventually occupying lands of 3 of its neighbors before being taken down by 4th… In any case, some sort of Intermarium probably was the only thing that could have prevented WWII in one shape or another.

by kibwen 2y ago

bojan 2y ago

While that is true, it is really important to add that that doesn't absolve the Germans one bit.

kibwen 2y ago
Indeed, though it's also true that the Germans should be held accountable for their own actions during the war, and not solely held responsible for WWI itself, which was a continent-wide effort.
- globalnode 2y ago
  why should they be? none of the so called winners are held accountable for their actions. best we can do is forget it all and move on, otherwise it will forever be a case of finger pointing.
  - kibwen 2y ago
    By "the Germans" I don't mean modern-day Germans, I mean the people of the era. And indeed, nobody should get a pass for the atrocities of war, the winners included. But no, we should not "forget it all", that's the worst possible thing you could do. The war happened, it was terrible, its consequences reverberate to this day, and we should all remember how it happened and why so that we can attempt to avoid having it happen again.

mantas 2y ago

There’s another important bit. Wilson policies played a big role in creating fractured Central Europe in interwar. I’m personally torn on this. On one hand, this gave my country a chance for independence. On the other hand, this made a bunch of puppets for Germany and Russia to play with. Maybe a unified buffer would have prevented WWII.

kibwen 2y ago
It's fine to speculate what could have been, but historically the record for regional "nation building" of this sort has been mixed at best, given the examples of former Czechoslovakia and Yugoslavia.
- mantas 2y ago
  Yep. But it was a mess either way. On the other hand, if there was some sort of Central Europe superpower building, Poland would probably have abused that. As it did anyway eventually occupying lands of 3 of its neighbors before being taken down by 4th… In any case, some sort of Intermarium probably was the only thing that could have prevented WWII in one shape or another.