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There is no fix for Intel's crashing 13th/14th Gen CPUs – damage is permanent
- billconan 2y agoI thought this was a huge issue for the company and their stock should tank. but somehow it went up today.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- kelthuzad 2y agoit's "up" by +0.31$ (1.01%) for today, but Intel is down -1.90$ (-5.69%) over the past 5 days and down -12.24$ (-28.03%) over the past 6 months and down -16.38$ (-34.28%) year to date and down -20.19$ (-39.14%) over the past 5 years.
- more_corn 2y agoI think what people outside the industry fail to realize is that people placing orders for tens of thousands of datacenter cpus don’t have time to fuck around with this. The preference for intel over AMD is very slight. They’re shifting orders from intel to AMD and will continue to do so till there’s a reasonable long term plan from intel. The next few quarters will be blood red for intel and crispy green for AMD
- vardump 2y agoInvestors have already known about this for a long time. Already priced in. Thus no reason to tank.
- billconan 2y agobut the root cause is worse than previous believed and there is no plan for a fix. this is something new I think.
- barkingcat 2y agono fix available means people will need to buy new chips to replace -> for an investor this is a good thing, and stock prices will speculatively rise.
- timbit42 2y agoHow many of those people do you think will buy an Intel CPU to replace their broken Intel CPU?
- barkingcat 2y agoIntel is still the incumbent in marketshare, so yes, most people will buy another broken Intel CPU to replace their broken Intel CPU at least for the next quarter. profit for stock holders, who don't care about the future.
- tombert 2y agoThe entire tech market has been insane for the last two weeks; it feels even less rational than it usually is.
- more_corn 2y agoI know! I was just in my portfolio to make sure I didn’t have any and noticed it’s up. Wallstreet will catch on soon. It’d be crazy if they didn’t notice till earnings were down for the next few quarters. I just bought a bunch of AMD instead. They’re about to have a couple bangin quarters as server orders shift AMD till this all gets sorted.
- geor9e 2y ago3-year warranty, not all customers are going to bother with an RMA exchange, a lot customers will make it the 3 years since the patch prevent further damage, an exchange costs Intel whatever manufacturing one more of the same old cpu costs, plus bulk shipping cost and overseas customer service agent hours. It's expensive but I don't know how high up it will be on the balance sheets after it's all said and done.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- nostrademons 2y agoCurious if this affects laptop chips, or just desktop? I've got a 13th gen i7 in my laptop that so far has not had any problems (well, except keyboard issues that seem to be due to the manufacturer), but would like to know if there's a risk of CPU issues in the future.
- cptroot 2y agoTFA sources Intel as saying even they don't know whether Laptops are affected, given similar circumstances.
- ec109685 2y agoIt’s answered in the FAQ at bottom of article that they are still investigating.
- thanksgiving 2y agoI’ve seen videos on YouTube where they say intel claims the issue with laptop chips is a separate issue which the videos go on to say that it is a strange thing to say if intel isn’t sure about the root cause of either issue.
- nequo 2y agoCould it be that the manufacturing defect only crashes the CPUs at a higher voltage, and the 13900HX/14900HX mobile CPUs run at a lower power (157 W) than the 13900K/14900K desktop CPUs (253 W)? If so, then Intel might be trying to spin this as the high voltage being the cause rather than oxidation or some other manufacturing problem.
- more_corn 2y agoMy understanding is that the chip is able to request higher voltage from the mainboard as demand increases. And it’s allowed to request an unsafe level of voltage. This is particularly problematic under high load.
- akmittal 2y ago
- LegitShady 2y agothis is a design/manufacturing defect and I expect Intel will replace any defective chips.
- Night_Thastus 2y agoIntel will absolutely minimize any concern about the manufacturing problem and focus on the microcode, quietly deny any permanent damage concerns, and do everything in their power to avoid a recall. For big buyers like data centers they'll capitulate, but for everyday consumers they'll resist as much as they can.
- paulmd 2y agothis is funny because it’s going to be the opposite. tray processors and even retail units both get reduced warranty in the datacenter and the people who are going to get screwed are those with a chip failing at 18 months or whatever, since that’s technically still out of warranty and consumer protections don’t typically apply to commercial operators. Consumers will be fine.
- Night_Thastus 2y agoThey've already been throwing trays full of CPUs at some of the bigger centers that have had issues with this. They knew it wouldn't fix the issue, but it was an easy - if expensive - way to patch it over.
- cmsj 2y agoLiterally addressed in TFA: "Intel has not halted sales or clawed back any inventory. It will not do a recall, period. The company is not currently commenting on whether or how it might extend its warranty. It would not share estimates with The Verge of how many chips are likely to be irreversibly impacted, and it did not explain why it’s continuing to sell these chips ahead of any fix."
- ronsor 2y ago
- 01HNNWZ0MV43FF 2y agoI think my last job had a bunch of 11th Gen nucs, hope they didn't upgrade into this.
- rwmj 2y agoSounds similar to the Intel Atom C2000 failures, where one of the metal layers responsible for a clock signal would fail after a few years leading to permanent failure. Intel ran a replacement programme for those (https://www.anandtech.com/show/11110/semi-critical-intel-atom-c2000-flaw-discovered https://www.anandtech.com/show/11110/semi-critical-intel-ato... https://www.theregister.com/2017/02/06/cisco_intel_decline_to_link_product_warning_to_faulty_chip/ https://www.theregister.com/2017/02/06/cisco_intel_decline_t...)
- samlinnfer 2y agoSo where is the microcode update? I don't see anything for Linux yet. https://github.com/intel/Intel-Linux-Processor-Microcode-Data-Files https://github.com/intel/Intel-Linux-Processor-Microcode-Dat...
- goosedragons 2y agoComing in mid-August.
- reaperman 2y agoExpected mid-August, just after the (slightly delayed) Ryzen 9000 launch. It's not known, but reasonably likely that this microcode patch will lower performance of the intel processors, so benchmarks between Ryzen 9000 and Intel 13th/14th gen will be artificially favorable to Intel's CPU's. Taking a wider view - there's widespread belief that both AMD and Intel are pushing the clocks of their CPU's too hard from the factory, and it's a bit of a prisoner's dilemma. If these types of issues force one company to set less aggressive clock speeds, the other company should be able to follow suit. Then end-users / partner channels would get more stable CPU's and enthusiasts would get a little extra headroom for overclock potential to play with if they are lucky with getting a "golden" CPU that can handle slightly higher voltages. Back in the day, overclockers expected to get a 25% chance of failure from aggressive overclocks, but it was just an accepted risk on their end. Obviously CPU's shouldn't have clock/voltage/temperature curves with 25% failure straight from the factory - which Intel's currently do!
- SketchySeaBeast 2y agoThe dark side of having healthy competition in a particular market. Though honestly, it doesn't much matter what Intel does, my next chip will be AMD. I can't justify a 250W CPU.
- fckgw 2y agoNot out yet. "Intel is delivering a microcode patch which addresses the root cause of exposure to elevated voltages. We are continuing validation to ensure that scenarios of instability reported to Intel regarding its Core 13th/14th Gen desktop processors are addressed. Intel is currently targeting mid-August for patch release to partners following full validation." https://community.intel.com/t5/Processors/July-2024-Update-on-Instability-Reports-on-Intel-Core-13th-and/m-p/1617113#M74792 https://community.intel.com/t5/Processors/July-2024-Update-o...
- pachouli-please 2y agoGamersNexus has had great coverage throughout this problem, even before Intel disclosure - Intel's CPUs Are Failing, ft. Wendell of Level1 Techs: https://youtu.be/oAE4NWoyMZk https://youtu.be/oAE4NWoyMZk - Intel Needs to Say Something: Oxidation Claims, New Microcode, & Benchmark Challenges: https://youtu.be/gTeubeCIwRw https://youtu.be/gTeubeCIwRw - Intel's Biggest Failure in Years: Confirmed Oxidation & Excessive Voltage: https://youtu.be/OVdmK1UGzGs https://youtu.be/OVdmK1UGzGs
- Qem 2y agoWith all those Intel shenanigans, I wonder what are the barriers for China to disrupt the x86 market? It has more to do with patents, or just lithography? With their current equipment, if they were to release homemade x86 chips in the international market, would they be able to compete at least in the low-end?
- thanksgiving 2y agoRemember the only reason Intel and AMD can sell these chips is because they have complex licenses that allow each other’s “IP”. I am positive these companies will NOT (at least not both of them) give mainland China based companies a blank check to their IP. They can do that after they return all our sweet, sweet free government money Intel got in the U.S. for so many decades.
- fluoridation 2y agoIt's not like China is known for caring about IP. All they'd have to do is not sell in the US.
- sterlind 2y agonot just the US, they couldn't sell to the West. Sanctions for an IP violation would likely bind all the signatories to WIPO or whatever. sure they could sell internally, but the chips would have to be pretty good to risk pissing off Intel and AMD, since they're not likely to keep doing business with China after that.
- shrubble 2y agoMicroCenter, a USA-based gamer/enthusiast focused computer retailer, sends me emails with motherboard/CPU/RAM bundles - they always have at least 1 AMD and 1 Intel option featured. The most recent one I got featured the Intel 12th gen CPU; no mention in the ad of 13th/14th gen CPUs, which is what they have been featuring for months, up to now.
- BadHumans 2y agoI remember when Ryzen was getting good and stable but people were holding off saying "no one ever got fired for buying Intel" because of AMD's history of bad drivers. How the tables have turned eh?
- VyseofArcadia 2y agoWhat, did people just completely forget about the Pentium floating point bugs? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentium_FDIV_bug https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentium_FDIV_bug
- frankjr 2y agoAn event that happened 30 years ago? Yes.
- georgeburdell 2y agoPat’s toast. I held onto my INTC shares for about 5 years longer than I should have, in the hope of a turnaround, but BOD will seek to clean house to try and repair the company’s image.
- goodburb 2y agoMy Skull Canyon NUC "eDRAM" (used for iGPU) died after the 1 year warranty which was a common issue posted on their forum, Intel surprisingly accepted return and refunded me completely (incl. international shipping). It's rare to get such service from big companies these days. The NUCs are low quantity relative to this though.
- georgeburdell 2y agoInteresting… I just replaced mine after nearly 8 years of operation. It had started to fail about 2 years ago though because it would throttle down to 900Mhz after about 30 mins of gaming, so it became the home automation/camera server
- antisthenes 2y agoThere's a video on YT with someone doing a multimeter inspection of the 13/14 gen CPUs. In order to achieve their clocks, they boost to insane voltages, which causes both instability and damage. Intel just fucked with raw physics and lost. They tried to play the "overclocker friend" for everyone and this is the result. You can't expect to run modern CPUs at 1.5-1.6V 24/7 and not have stability/failure issues.