3 ms·

That seems hard to believe. Are you thinking of the refining process?

toomuchtodo 2y ago
https://www.reuters.com/business/environment/us-corn-based-ethanol-worse-climate-than-gasoline-study-finds-2022-02-14/ https://www.reuters.com/business/environment/us-corn-based-e... https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7320919/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7320919/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corn_ethanol#Greenhouse_gas_emissions https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corn_ethanol#Greenhouse_gas_em... Ethanol replaced MTBE, which was good (MTBE is terrible comparitively), but now it's turned into a 43 million acre per year ag subsidy program. There is no political will to remove the subsidy, due to the folks who receive these subsidies having outsized political influence, so demand destruction will be a function of EV uptake (destroying overall blended gasoline demand over time). Agrivoltaics would also be a great alternative if you could convince enough folks to buy in.
- drpgq 2y ago
  Anyone know if gasoline demand in the US is still rising?
  - toomuchtodo 2y ago
    https://www.eia.gov/petroleum/weekly/gasoline.php https://www.eia.gov/petroleum/weekly/gasoline.php https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/bumpy-road-ahead-us-gasoline-demand-energy-transition-2023-07-24/ https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/bumpy-road-ahead-us-... https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/weak-us-gasoline-demand-compounds-pressure-oil-ahead-opec-meet-2024-05-31/ https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/weak-us-gasoline-dem... https://wolfstreet.com/2024/03/07/gasoline-demand-has-a-long-term-structural-problem-plunging-per-capita-consumption/ https://wolfstreet.com/2024/03/07/gasoline-demand-has-a-long... https://electrek.co/2024/03/02/1-in-5-new-car-sales-globally-in-were-evs-in-2023-oil-demand-iea/ https://electrek.co/2024/03/02/1-in-5-new-car-sales-globally... https://www.coxautoinc.com/market-insights/q2-2024-ev-sales/ https://www.coxautoinc.com/market-insights/q2-2024-ev-sales/ https://www.energy.ca.gov/news/2024-05/zero-emission-vehicle-sales-remain-strong-california https://www.energy.ca.gov/news/2024-05/zero-emission-vehicle...
- smallmancontrov 2y ago
  From the last time the "ethanol is worse than gasoline" story did the rounds, I seem to remember that the entire argument boiled down to a gigantic one-time land use adjustment term that swamped the benefits. What was that about?
Tagbert 2y ago
The fuel used for turning the soil, planting the seeds, spraying harvesting, drying. The energy used to make the fertilizer. Water and energy to irrigate. Then the refining and transportation of the alchohol. Corn takes a lot of input energy. I believe that sugarcane is closer to break even as it requires less upkeep.
- PaulHoule 2y ago
  See https://www.intechopen.com/chapters/84069 https://www.intechopen.com/chapters/84069

https://www.reuters.com/business/environment/us-corn-based-ethanol-worse-climate-than-gasoline-study-finds-2022-02-14/ https://www.reuters.com/business/environment/us-corn-based-e... https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7320919/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7320919/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corn_ethanol#Greenhouse_gas_emissions https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corn_ethanol#Greenhouse_gas_em... Ethanol replaced MTBE, which was good (MTBE is terrible comparitively), but now it's turned into a 43 million acre per year ag subsidy program. There is no political will to remove the subsidy, due to the folks who receive these subsidies having outsized political influence, so demand destruction will be a function of EV uptake (destroying overall blended gasoline demand over time). Agrivoltaics would also be a great alternative if you could convince enough folks to buy in.

drpgq 2y ago
Anyone know if gasoline demand in the US is still rising?
- toomuchtodo 2y ago
  https://www.eia.gov/petroleum/weekly/gasoline.php https://www.eia.gov/petroleum/weekly/gasoline.php https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/bumpy-road-ahead-us-gasoline-demand-energy-transition-2023-07-24/ https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/bumpy-road-ahead-us-... https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/weak-us-gasoline-demand-compounds-pressure-oil-ahead-opec-meet-2024-05-31/ https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/weak-us-gasoline-dem... https://wolfstreet.com/2024/03/07/gasoline-demand-has-a-long-term-structural-problem-plunging-per-capita-consumption/ https://wolfstreet.com/2024/03/07/gasoline-demand-has-a-long... https://electrek.co/2024/03/02/1-in-5-new-car-sales-globally-in-were-evs-in-2023-oil-demand-iea/ https://electrek.co/2024/03/02/1-in-5-new-car-sales-globally... https://www.coxautoinc.com/market-insights/q2-2024-ev-sales/ https://www.coxautoinc.com/market-insights/q2-2024-ev-sales/ https://www.energy.ca.gov/news/2024-05/zero-emission-vehicle-sales-remain-strong-california https://www.energy.ca.gov/news/2024-05/zero-emission-vehicle...
smallmancontrov 2y ago
From the last time the "ethanol is worse than gasoline" story did the rounds, I seem to remember that the entire argument boiled down to a gigantic one-time land use adjustment term that swamped the benefits. What was that about?

Tagbert 2y ago

The fuel used for turning the soil, planting the seeds, spraying harvesting, drying. The energy used to make the fertilizer. Water and energy to irrigate. Then the refining and transportation of the alchohol. Corn takes a lot of input energy. I believe that sugarcane is closer to break even as it requires less upkeep.

PaulHoule 2y ago
See https://www.intechopen.com/chapters/84069 https://www.intechopen.com/chapters/84069