4 ms·

> we're a bit intrigued by the potential for the "Cheaters Pool" to evolve into a new mode of play that some players might actually prefer. Unregulated cheats

> we're a bit intrigued by the potential for the "Cheaters Pool" to evolve into a new mode of play that some players might actually prefer. Unregulated cheats and hacks led a friend and I to inadvertently invent a proto-minecraft over a decade ago. Around 1998, I was playing Dark Forces 2: Jedi Knight when I started to experience cheats and hacks. Someone taught me how to do it, which was incredibly easy (each weapon file was a text file with variables you could change: projectile=bullet, damage=5, speed=3). Simply replacing the file client side would change the behavior. When playing around with the projectile=[id] with some ids I found while map making, a friend and I discovered we could modify all of our weapons to shoot out various world objects such as bridges, platforms, doors, etc. We started playing the game almost exclusively this way for quite awhile, going off to separate corners of a map, building things, then comparing our structures. So, I have to say, great idea on the quarantine, Rockstar!

nohat 14y ago
I made blaster rifles that shot destructions, but never realized you could shoot map features. That sounds like the potential for interesting fps: remake the map as you go.
- younata 14y ago
  There's a TF2 mod that is kinda like that. You start the game, and have 2 minutes to create defenses. After that, it's a normal game of CTF. I forget what it's called though.
  - visionpol 14y ago
    The game mode is called Fort Wars. Source: http://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/FortWars http://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/FortWars
    - stcredzero 14y ago
      Someone should do a mod of that, based on characters from the old A-Team TV show, complete with the original theme music. The "build defenses" interval would be like the build weapons montage. http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Series/TheATeam?from=Main.TheATeam http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Series/TheATeam?from=M...
- icebraining 14y ago
  The Cube 2 FPS is designed exactly for that: real-time in-game map editing. It's also FOSS and multi-platform. http://sauerbraten.org/ http://sauerbraten.org/
- planetguy 14y ago
  Shooting + digging = World War One
- whatusername 14y ago
  In 1999 the Wheel Of Time game with it's Citadel mode was an early example of this. The original design was much more open-ended -- production realities meant that the end result was CTF with a 2 minute period at the start to setup traps in your home base. See: http://www.worch.com/portfolio/wot/ http://www.worch.com/portfolio/wot/ for a description of the planned vs implemented Citadel mode.
  - marvin 14y ago
    It's a shame the Wheel of Time game didn't become more popular. Even with the limited implementation of the Citadel mode, I still haven't seen anything like the combination of strategy and FPS action that you get when duelling. Tremulous comes pretty close when it comes to strategy when building stuff in team matches, though.
jboggan 14y ago
I was playing that game (Trandoshan FTW!) around the same time and was always playing clean. However I kept winning matches because I found a good tactic (stick two time-delayed rockets in their back, then send a third to detonate all three on impact -> kills anyone with full health and shields with "one" hit) and was repeatedly tossed from servers for "cheating." Eventually I quit playing because everyone was so paranoid about booting cheaters and I couldn't play two matches without an interruption. I think the cheater's pool is a great idea though. It should be amusing at the least.
marvin 14y ago
Hahaha...that's great, Jedi Knight was my first real exposure to programming. Great times trying to make more and more sophisticated modifications of the game files...either legitly (custom levels, mods) and to use in unsuspecting multiplayer games on MSN Gaming Zone. I remember some members of the modding community ending up becoming serious level designers or game developers. You could actually make more complicated hacks by making deeper modifications to the weapon/force power scripts. The game had a simple checksum on the client-side script files where it did a rudimentary count on the number of statements (method argument: one statement, pair of parentheses: one statement), and if you had a count identical to the server file, the rest of the contents of your script didn't matter. So you could basically do a lot of stuff as long as you were careful to keep the script file statement count intact: Change the properties of the levels or surfaces, give yourself all sorts of superpowers, freeze or insta-kill opponents, teleport yourself or others, etc etc etc. The scripting language was somewhat C-like and carried over pretty easily to more traditional programming.
- walexander 14y ago
  > Jedi Knight was my first real exposure to programming. Yeah, I was in middle school at the time. I think between hacking that game, HTML on angelfire, and the TI-83 calculator, my trajectory for life was set.
- teamonkey 14y ago
  > I remember some members of the modding community ending up becoming serious level designers or game developers. I was one of them. COG scripting was my intro to game modding. I'd been writing small games until that point, but COG made the game a platform to develop for and that was different to anything I'd seen before.
  - zacharycohn 14y ago
    Did you ever hang out on Massassi? I still frequent it, it's always fun to hear people talking about JK and find out that you knew them 10 years ago...

nohat 14y ago

I made blaster rifles that shot destructions, but never realized you could shoot map features. That sounds like the potential for interesting fps: remake the map as you go.

younata 14y ago
There's a TF2 mod that is kinda like that. You start the game, and have 2 minutes to create defenses. After that, it's a normal game of CTF. I forget what it's called though.
- visionpol 14y ago
  The game mode is called Fort Wars. Source: http://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/FortWars http://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/FortWars
  - stcredzero 14y ago
    Someone should do a mod of that, based on characters from the old A-Team TV show, complete with the original theme music. The "build defenses" interval would be like the build weapons montage. http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Series/TheATeam?from=Main.TheATeam http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Series/TheATeam?from=M...
icebraining 14y ago
The Cube 2 FPS is designed exactly for that: real-time in-game map editing. It's also FOSS and multi-platform. http://sauerbraten.org/ http://sauerbraten.org/
planetguy 14y ago
Shooting + digging = World War One
whatusername 14y ago
In 1999 the Wheel Of Time game with it's Citadel mode was an early example of this. The original design was much more open-ended -- production realities meant that the end result was CTF with a 2 minute period at the start to setup traps in your home base. See: http://www.worch.com/portfolio/wot/ http://www.worch.com/portfolio/wot/ for a description of the planned vs implemented Citadel mode.
- marvin 14y ago
  It's a shame the Wheel of Time game didn't become more popular. Even with the limited implementation of the Citadel mode, I still haven't seen anything like the combination of strategy and FPS action that you get when duelling. Tremulous comes pretty close when it comes to strategy when building stuff in team matches, though.

jboggan 14y ago

I was playing that game (Trandoshan FTW!) around the same time and was always playing clean. However I kept winning matches because I found a good tactic (stick two time-delayed rockets in their back, then send a third to detonate all three on impact -> kills anyone with full health and shields with "one" hit) and was repeatedly tossed from servers for "cheating." Eventually I quit playing because everyone was so paranoid about booting cheaters and I couldn't play two matches without an interruption. I think the cheater's pool is a great idea though. It should be amusing at the least.

marvin 14y ago

Hahaha...that's great, Jedi Knight was my first real exposure to programming. Great times trying to make more and more sophisticated modifications of the game files...either legitly (custom levels, mods) and to use in unsuspecting multiplayer games on MSN Gaming Zone. I remember some members of the modding community ending up becoming serious level designers or game developers. You could actually make more complicated hacks by making deeper modifications to the weapon/force power scripts. The game had a simple checksum on the client-side script files where it did a rudimentary count on the number of statements (method argument: one statement, pair of parentheses: one statement), and if you had a count identical to the server file, the rest of the contents of your script didn't matter. So you could basically do a lot of stuff as long as you were careful to keep the script file statement count intact: Change the properties of the levels or surfaces, give yourself all sorts of superpowers, freeze or insta-kill opponents, teleport yourself or others, etc etc etc. The scripting language was somewhat C-like and carried over pretty easily to more traditional programming.

walexander 14y ago
> Jedi Knight was my first real exposure to programming. Yeah, I was in middle school at the time. I think between hacking that game, HTML on angelfire, and the TI-83 calculator, my trajectory for life was set.
teamonkey 14y ago
> I remember some members of the modding community ending up becoming serious level designers or game developers. I was one of them. COG scripting was my intro to game modding. I'd been writing small games until that point, but COG made the game a platform to develop for and that was different to anything I'd seen before.
- zacharycohn 14y ago
  Did you ever hang out on Massassi? I still frequent it, it's always fun to hear people talking about JK and find out that you knew them 10 years ago...