4 ms·

Making which seat you’ll get a mystery until check-in wasn’t much fun and made boarding slow. Glad to see it go. $50/seat for early boarding position, so it’s

Making which seat you’ll get a mystery until check-in wasn’t much fun and made boarding slow. Glad to see it go. $50/seat for early boarding position, so it’s not like they weren’t already charging more for an aisle or window near the front.

space_fountain 2y ago
I've definitely heard claims that not having assigned seats speeds up boarding. There's some logic to both positions to me. Do you have any hard numbers?
- kolbe 2y ago
  With a little googling, at the very least it's clear to me that some form of back-to-front is most efficient, and Southwest inevitably doesn't do that because the first people on want to be closest to the front in order to get off quicker.
  - vundercind 2y ago
    Southwest fills front to back and aisle and window before middle. It’s practically optimized to be bad.
    - kolbe 2y ago
      While this is true in theory, I don't know if it's been established in fact. There's some sort of rumor/myth/legend that Southwest's open seating is most efficient in practice, but I can't see any data to support this claim, and I'm dubious of it. The models don't cleanly capture things like breaking up families, adding confusion, etc. Southwest also has an interesting incentive structure where you're rewarded for being on time and getting into position with a better seat. While on other airlines, your incentive is the other way, where you'd prefer to stay off the plane as long as possible. I don't know the net practical effect.
      - xscott 2y ago
        Another feature is that they let "parents with small children" board earlier in the process, so if you get on after that you can avoid sitting near the screaming, crying, and kicking seats.
    - readthenotes1 2y ago
      Southwest has the fastest turnaround times amongst the major US airlines, so there must be something wrong with theory. https://www.oag.com/blog/innovative-airline-operations-the-turnaround https://www.oag.com/blog/innovative-airline-operations-the-t...
  - space_fountain 2y ago
    Yes, but no airlines use this boarding flow. Most do more or less the worst boarding flow. They board front to back. Here's an article claiming southwest wins in the real world (https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/16/business/airline-boarding-process-explained/index.html#:~:text=Southwest%20Airlines%20has%20the%20fastest%20boarding%20process%20of%20any%20major%20airline%20by%20simply%20allowing%20people%20to%20claim%20the%20first%20available%20seat.%20It%20works%20because%20passengers%20spend%20less%20time%20waiting%20in%20the%20aisle%2C%20and%20have%20more%20freedom%20to%20sit%20where%20it%E2%80%99s%20least%20crowded https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/16/business/airline-boarding-pro...)
mysterydip 2y ago
The times I flew on southwest, boarding was just uncomfortable. Everyone who was already there was looking at you like "please don't sit next to us, we want our middle seat to stay empty" even knowing it's a full flight.
- 123456atx 2y ago
  last time we were coming back from san diego my wife asked a lady near the front to move her bag so we could sit down. she was trying to take a whole row of seats to herself. When we asked her she looked at her partner across the aisle like we just farted in her face, she got up and they went to get a row in the back.
- vundercind 2y ago
  Oh yeah, if you’re on the later end of Group C it means you’re gonna be deciding which person to give the bad news to. It sucks.

space_fountain 2y ago

I've definitely heard claims that not having assigned seats speeds up boarding. There's some logic to both positions to me. Do you have any hard numbers?

kolbe 2y ago
With a little googling, at the very least it's clear to me that some form of back-to-front is most efficient, and Southwest inevitably doesn't do that because the first people on want to be closest to the front in order to get off quicker.
- vundercind 2y ago
  Southwest fills front to back and aisle and window before middle. It’s practically optimized to be bad.
  - kolbe 2y ago
    While this is true in theory, I don't know if it's been established in fact. There's some sort of rumor/myth/legend that Southwest's open seating is most efficient in practice, but I can't see any data to support this claim, and I'm dubious of it. The models don't cleanly capture things like breaking up families, adding confusion, etc. Southwest also has an interesting incentive structure where you're rewarded for being on time and getting into position with a better seat. While on other airlines, your incentive is the other way, where you'd prefer to stay off the plane as long as possible. I don't know the net practical effect.
    - xscott 2y ago
      Another feature is that they let "parents with small children" board earlier in the process, so if you get on after that you can avoid sitting near the screaming, crying, and kicking seats.
  - readthenotes1 2y ago
    Southwest has the fastest turnaround times amongst the major US airlines, so there must be something wrong with theory. https://www.oag.com/blog/innovative-airline-operations-the-turnaround https://www.oag.com/blog/innovative-airline-operations-the-t...
- space_fountain 2y ago
  Yes, but no airlines use this boarding flow. Most do more or less the worst boarding flow. They board front to back. Here's an article claiming southwest wins in the real world (https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/16/business/airline-boarding-process-explained/index.html#:~:text=Southwest%20Airlines%20has%20the%20fastest%20boarding%20process%20of%20any%20major%20airline%20by%20simply%20allowing%20people%20to%20claim%20the%20first%20available%20seat.%20It%20works%20because%20passengers%20spend%20less%20time%20waiting%20in%20the%20aisle%2C%20and%20have%20more%20freedom%20to%20sit%20where%20it%E2%80%99s%20least%20crowded https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/16/business/airline-boarding-pro...)

mysterydip 2y ago

The times I flew on southwest, boarding was just uncomfortable. Everyone who was already there was looking at you like "please don't sit next to us, we want our middle seat to stay empty" even knowing it's a full flight.

123456atx 2y ago
last time we were coming back from san diego my wife asked a lady near the front to move her bag so we could sit down. she was trying to take a whole row of seats to herself. When we asked her she looked at her partner across the aisle like we just farted in her face, she got up and they went to get a row in the back.
vundercind 2y ago
Oh yeah, if you’re on the later end of Group C it means you’re gonna be deciding which person to give the bad news to. It sucks.